Ep.13 - Wade Redden - NHL All Star - "One of the Best of an Era"

Wade Redden was one of the top Defenseman in the best league on earth for the better part of the 2000's.

He was drafted 2nd overall to the New York Islanders before getting traded to the Ottawa Senators where he spent the majority of his career.

Wade was the assistant captain on a team that made it to the Stanley Cup finals and had one of the most decorated careers out of anyone over the span of a decade.

Wade was 2 time NHL All-Star, 2 time World Junior Championship gold medalist, 1 time World Cup gold medalist, 1 time World Championship silver medalist, 1 time Western Hockey League champion and a former Team Canada Olympian.

However, this interview gets very interesting as Wade opens up about what happened towards the end of his career and how he found his way to the minor leagues, even after such a successful 10 years in the National Hockey League.

This goes to show that no matter who you were in the past, no spot is guaranteed..

Enjoy episode 13 on the Up My Hockey podcast.

Transcript

spk_1:   0:11
welcomed up My hockey with Jason Podollan, where we deconstruct the NHL journey, discuss what it takes to make it and have a few laughs along the way. I'm your host. Jason Podollan, a 31st overall draft pick who played 41 NHL games but thought he was destined for 1000. Learned from my story and those of my guests. This is a hockey podcast of a reaching your potential. Hey there. Hi there. Welcome back or welcome to you listeners. Toe up my hockey with Jason Podollan. I'm Jason Podollan, and today we have the privilege of having weighed red and on the podcast. Wade is 1000 game NHL veteran with a resume that is almost too long to go over. But I'm going to do my best to go over this man's lengthy resume. He started his junior career with the Brandon Wheat Kings, the WHL, where he played for three seasons. Wade was the WHL rookie of the year his first season. He went on to be a WHL all star, where he, uh where I had a chance to play with him in Prince George. He was also a two time gold medalist with the world junior team, first and red deer and then in Boston with me and 96. His first gold was in 95. Went to the Memorial Cup championships twice. He beat us Spokane in the league championships the second time, which I still cannot get over. Ah, he was a second round draft pick. Not second round. No, no, no, no second overall to the New York Islanders, his draft year. Bryan Berard. When first. That was when he end up getting traded to the Senators who drafted Berard first. It was a strange trade that usually never happens, but he end up becoming a senator, where he spent 11 seasons with the sins. Ended up being the assistant captain of that team that went to the Stanley Cup championships against Anaheim. He was a two time NHL All star. He also represented Canada in 2004 at the World Cup. He represented Canada again at the 2006 Olympics, and this guy ended up going on to playing with the Rangers. He ended up going on to play with ST Louis. He ended up going on to play in Boston, where he went to the finals again with Boston. And what a career this guy really was one of the best of his era. Uh, I'm really, really proud to have him on. It was great to have a discussion with them. He was very, very generous with his time. Ah, and it was great to talk with an old friend and an old teammate. So without further ado, I bring you Wade Redden. All right, here we got I got Wade Redden on the podcast. Welcomed up my hockey way.

spk_0:   2:59
Yes, Thank you, Jason. Good to be

spk_1:   3:00
here. Yeah, you just ran into Yeah, we ran into each other in a in an airport in Ah, Mexico. Coming home like that was probably 56 years ago now and then again in ah, in a parking lot in subway there with during the plaster Purvin and got shut down, which is which is crazy because obviously we go back. You mean our junior days is where we really were across him past the ton, and then our careers took a different path, and it's great to have you on here. I'd love to kind of explore some of that stuff, you know, even back in those days. Maybe even a little bit before we got to the WHL and walk some guys through. I know a lot of guys. Listen, right now that are that are here are worried about the bantam draft, which is coming up in the WHL Bantam draft. And I think that's kind of an interesting age to start, because hockey kind of starts getting really at that point. And I know more so for the guys now than maybe for us because it wasn't as big of a deal back then. But, um, I know you were part of a draft there in 90 to Was it Was that the 90 to ban it?

spk_0:   4:02
I guess it would get three years somewhere. Yeah,

spk_1:   4:06
I think it was a 90 to dry up because I was looking at. And I know that I was one of the guys. I'm a year older than you. The draft had already been instituted, but there was a few of us that had already been listed, uh, prior. So like my draft. It was myself. Jeff Friesen. And, um what's his name? Travis Clayton was Ah, yes. Yeah. There was three of us that had already been listed were listed his 13 year olds, and we weren't eligible for the draft. But I believe your draft was the first year where every single player was eligible for that draft because no one had been listed. Do you remember that? Is that accurate?

spk_0:   4:38
Well, yeah, It could be right, actually. So mentioned that named Travis Clayton. I grew up playing with him since I was, like, eight years old, and Hughes and I played against Jeff was also up in metal aches, a sketch, and just north of where I'm from. So we knew those guys very well and yeah, I mean, they're the best players in the country, and I mean, I didn't know you had that time, but obviously rate in the same realm of things and and then, yeah, I guess in those days the draft was just kind of starting out. You said I was part of the 2nd 1 so it didn't really have a lot of notoriety. There wasn't a lot of talked about it. I mean, you didn't have all the information that kids have nowadays. So, um, I remember getting drafted, though, and it was during provincials were playing down in Warm and Saskatchewan and our team with Travis and my brother, whatever. We had a good little team and I think we were doing it. A syriza were down and warm in the night before the draft is happening, and I had no clue as kind of innocent to hell. But there's a bunch of scouts and a bunch of people that remember we're talking to my dad about it. And then, sure enough, the next day I got drafted by the weak kings and, um, we kind of had a connection. Kelly McCrimmon had coached and Lloyd Minster and his dad had played some senior hockey way back in the day. And my dad knew the family. So other than the fact is, a nine hour drive from home, we're pretty happy to be going to brand. Uh and it worked out very well from there, But yeah, I was, uh, as as a big time obvious to you. I was like I said a little naive to it all and probably understand what was really happening. But as playing provincial hawking and I just love playing hockey. So at a chance toe to join. You know, we've seen a few blades, games and stuff. That was my only connection with Western League, but obviously excited to be part of the week Kings,

spk_1:   6:34
was it was it? Because now it is so different, right? It's so different, Like talking with the families that are doing it. And and again, you know, I knew it was a good I was new is a good player, right? But it wasn't, you know, there wasn't the craziness, right? You mean like, yeah, you got listed on your birthday. So you knew that you were supposed to be one of the top guys and, you know, maybe one of the top three guys for me at the time of your drafted second overall. So you knew that you were obviously somewhere up in the higher realms of the development curve. But again, there was no, There was no Internet rankings. There is no this. There is no that rights. We were kind of in a little bit of a bubble with that. And now these guys like they watch their stock go up and down. You know, they're 14 years old and that's all they're talking about. Their trying to be on the right team and they want to hit the right tournament. And, um, you know, they don't want to go to that team that's death 12 hours away. Or, you know, the parents are saying, Well, there's no way we're going there and it kind of gets a little bit nuts. So when you say, um, you know it was nine hours away, but I was happy to go like, Is that is that being really like Were you happy to go nine hours away or where you're like Holy smokes, man, I'm not sure about this, but you win anyways.

spk_0:   7:39
Well, I went anyways. I mean, I guess looking back at things and as a 16 year old kid moving away from home, they mean you leave miss out on a lot when you're away from your parents that long and are from for that far, Um, so obviously didn't really appreciate it. I love going. I love plan. There's a little bit of a tough transition initially, toe, you know, to be away from home and do all that. But once you sink in and become part of a team, I was pretty fortunate to have a good group of guys and a good team and a good organization that kind of bring us in. But, um yeah, I know it was, uh I was happy to go, I guess at the end of the day and, uh, it was a great experience. My junior days were a lot of fun. I mean, looking at kids nowadays, though, and the hype that's put into it, I feel a little. Yeah, I feel bad for some of these kids there. At 14 years old, they're moving the different academies and prep schools. And I don't believe I mean, I can't find it hard to believe that that's what page need to do. I guess there is this come a point in those days where I mean e I mean, a kid from a small town. I'm from a small town. It's a Scatchard. So what is this kid need to do If if I was living today what? I need to move away and play with the team? I hope I wouldn't after at 14 years old, but it seems to be happening. Um, I just think it's, you know, as far as a kid developing it It it's a big, big onus on a kid to move away from their parents of that age. I I don't think you see the probably see all the you know, the sacrifices that it requires our amounts to it today. But, you know, that's a development time for these kids. And to be away from home, that's such a a big thing.

spk_1:   9:34
I believe me and I I hear I can hear in your voice and maybe maybe knowing a bit about you like the perspective is way different as a father to because you look for sure. I mean, I'm sitting here with the 10 year old, a nine year old in ah, a seven year old that all love hockey, and Hudson's potentially 56 years away from moving out. And I'm like a You kidding me like that's That's what I did right? And I was an on Lee child, and my parents, like, supported that, and that's like it seems crazy, but at the time when you're 16 it doesn't seem crazy, right? It's that's what you want to do and it's the reading. You're chasing it. Is this like yeah, hell yeah, Let's go, right? Um, yes, but even with that, like if we could go back because guys get so wound up and I want to focus on the draft for a little bit, like in the anxiety and where they're going to go and who's going to take him? And what if your first rounder or 1/3 rounder, like I think, make a guy like Travis Clayton is maybe perfect talk about, like, what happened with Travis? Like, he was one of the best in the nation. And then what happened with Travis? And what do you think? His store? How did that story Turnout?

spk_0:   10:33
Well, like I said, I mean, we grew up since I was five years old. I played against him then our little towns were only, like, 20 minutes apart. So by the time we're 89 years old, we join teams because of the you know, we needed kids toe make a team. So he was, you know, 12 13 years old bank. He's been the same size. He was like the biggest kid, and so he didn't grow, But still, he went on to play Junior and North Battleford and he, you know is there all time? Leading scorer? He he just made the decision. I think he could have gone scholarship. He had opportunities to do that and any any chose not to. And he went down, played a lot of pro years and played a little bit in the i h l so maybe use and then using Wichita for for a long time, But, um, so right now we may, but yeah, he had the opportunity. ANC. He was always talked because he got listed by Saskatoon Blades. And, uh, no, I never ended up going there, but I never knew the reason why. No, he was always a top player, little guy. But

spk_1:   11:41
he did play. I guess my point is this, like, it's injury. You look back in those drafts, right? Guys get really wound up about You know what that means to them in their career. And, you know, it means something of that age, but doesn't mean much because guys are just starting their development. Right, guys, we're just getting going. Um, and there's lots of different pass. Right? So you mean you look back, Even on your year? I think there might have been six guys that even played in the NHL from that entire bantam draft, let alone you know me and have have really careers. Go look at that. It's really wild, right? Um, to see, I mean, how hard it is to make. So I mean, I guess it's like anything else. You get drafted higher in the NHL draft. I think your opportunity maybe goes up a Sfar as what? You know, your role on that team and how many chances air kind of going to get give you. And I think the same would be said for the WHL scenario, like making the team. But it's by no means a make or break scenario, right? And I stuff when you're in the moment, I think. But I mean, my messages like this relaxed right? Just breathed and take care where you can take care of which is which is not where you get drafted. It's what you're doing off the icer on the ice, right? That's gonna help you the most.

spk_0:   12:47
Yeah, and that's a great I mean, that's all you can do, really, at the end of the day and these kids they do. I remember being around the uh, like they stopped doing it now, but they had the Western Canadian battle championship here a few years ago. I think the Western League actually sponsored the tournament. So they're in there, given their message. These kids are all 14 15 years old and, um, getting hyped up about the Western League. But do you know what? As far as a kids development, yeah, the Western needs a good option college. Good option. But there is a lot of bonus, as you say about this draft, and it is crazy cause there's lots of stories to where kids don't get drafted. Then they grow six inches and become great. Players are you know, kids are the top player at the 12 13 and and then they just kind of peek at that level like there's there's different roads for all these kids, and I guess it's having that the right mindset. Uh, you know what to believe in yourself. Toe have that work ethic, you know, if you want to do something, if you believe in that and and I guess at the end of their kid knows where he stands and things and as you develop and as you go on, it's It's just putting, working and doing what you need to do to get to the next level. Some kids are gonna develop and be there Some art. Yeah, and I don't know. I don't think you need to put too much stock in this draft because there's a lot of kids. It's they find their way, whether they're taken high or not.

spk_1:   14:21
Yeah, yeah. Get take care waiting to take care of At the end of the day your your journey. I saw that you before you went to Brandon. You played ah Jr a right. And that was similar to me as well as a 15 year old I played in predicting with the Panthers. Paul Career was on that team and and Jeff Story and some other guys. So, um, that was a big move for me because I was either gonna play second year bantam, um, try and play midget somewhere. Or maybe play. BC Junior decided to play BC Jr personally had a pretty good year to score 20 goals there. I mean, it's a man's league, right? You're playing with 20 year old man and it was a tough league. So It was a good ah, you know, initiation. I guess what was ahead in the WHL was there, Like, how did you navigate that? As as that point Was that your decision with your your parents heavily involved in where you're gonna play that year before, before the W H o.

spk_0:   15:09
Well, I guess my option waas cause there's no midget Triple A. I know. Lawyer admits here I just grew up outside of Lloyd and they have made to Tripoli. Now they don't They didn't in those days, so I My next option video Nor would you have been to go to North Battleford and play midget trip Play with them Probably was the I think something that was kind of an option. Um, I ended up going to the junior camp for the Blazers. The age HL team. And Lloyd ended up getting cut initially. And then I went down to Junior B and Lloyd. I was gonna as prepared to play junior B and Lloyd, which is again playing against older guys and a decent lead. They ended up in a really good team in those days that Lloyd Mr Bad Nets, But so I get sent down. I played 10 games and I get called up to the to the Blazers the age HL team and end up sticking in there, so end up playing as a 15 year old. But again, I think the biggest issue there was leaving home like I was 15. I didn't want to move to North Battleford and which is only an hour and 1/2 down the road. But to be away from home, that was not an option. So, um, I stayed home. I was prepared to play junior B and and then ended up being on Junior A at the end of it. But yeah, it's Yeah, the thing that comes back to me With all this and kids moving away from all make, that's That's the biggest concern I have. Like at 14 15 that such a nearly time to be moving. I know it's required sometimes, but yeah, it's just that za tough for a

spk_1:   16:48
tough decision for parents and for kids. Was Brandon at all involved at that point with that decision? Worried about your development being the number two guy?

spk_0:   16:56
Yeah, yeah, they came. And, um, obviously well, they're great with No, they wanted to do what was right in all situations. But they watched. They came and watched Junior B game. Remember the one scope being there? And he said, Yeah, this is This will be fine form. So yeah. So I was prepared to play in the jungle for the year, but

spk_1:   17:20
yeah, as it was, it was It was the general. Yeah, well, areas, actually. Um, did you move on? You go to the WHL That 16 year old, um, and was, you know, I mean, you had Ah, you had a bright light over top of your head. Kind of from the moment you walked in the league and you were recognized on the national level, which was where you and I cross paths for the first time. Um, because I'd actually didn't I love doing the research actually for this and looking into guys because, um, I just never realized at the time, Or at least I didn't remember that you were actually your younger. So when we played on that under 18 team for Canada because you went to Japan, right?

spk_0:   17:55
No, no, I wasn't there. You

spk_1:   17:57
went on that team? No. Okay. You were not on that team size with No, Neil. I thought you were on that team. And like Phillips was amount Phillips. Ah. Okay. I was talking to Mike. What the other day? Who was on our world junior team? I know, I know. I got that one. Right. So I was talking to water the other day and what he was on that under 18 team, and that was just such a such a Western heavy team as well. And I just for some reason, I thought that you were that you were on that team as well. But you did play under its your own year, then, I guess, right?

spk_0:   18:25
Yeah. In our year, we went to Mexico City, Actually. Really? I don't know. What would there have been? Only four teams. When you went,

spk_1:   18:33
we only had four. Yeah, that's what

spk_0:   18:36
we had. Was it probably under 20?

spk_1:   18:40
No, it was under It was under 18 at for Japan. It was Japan, us, us. And jeez, Russia, I think Russia,

spk_0:   18:49
that's that would have been the same for us, but yeah, that's in Mexico City the next year. Okay, so, uh,

spk_1:   18:55
that was a lot of you. Yeah, way. Which may be, which is which is actually a cool little Segway, because, like World Junior, you played on that on the locker world Junior team is under age, and I was the year you end up going second overall in the NHL draft like that must have been crazy experience to be on that team.

spk_0:   19:13
The tournament was in Red Deer that year. So just down the road from where I grew up and then there ended up being two guys got injured Jamie, Alison and I think, is it, uh, Armstrong? Derek Armstrong. But a guy, They're both top D guys.

spk_1:   19:36
Chris Armstrong. Chris

spk_0:   19:37
Armstrong. He wasn't this doubts, right?

spk_1:   19:40
Florida Dropkick. He was with me and with the Panthers for a while.

spk_0:   19:43
Yeah, right. So they both got injured at the camp, and then I was kind of next man standing. So I made the team. I ended up getting some power play. Whatever was in a bit of a role like that and got a few goals and whatever. So, you know, that was a great team, though. They had well, Marty, Mary and Jamie Alison Jason Allison. Sorry. Forward Top Ford of the tournament, then Brian McCabe anyways, Another Spokane chief there with? Yeah. Yeah, Cable was a top demon in the tournament, the eyes and unreal team, and obviously went on to win every game and got the gold medal. But I was great experience. And

spk_1:   20:20
then that was still there was still a round robin format to write, though there was no final that year. Correct?

spk_0:   20:26
Yeah, that was the last year that in the next year with you, we was the first year with the round robin. But always laugh. I got to just say this about the world, junior. Remember our time in Boston, and I'm pretty sure it was you, but we're singing Sadie Hawkins memory where in the back of the bus and his memory had a great voice back. Yeah, song it was. But there was Was it, Jerome? And there's really 45 guys trying to sing this song, and just belting it out is so I still laugh with that.

spk_1:   21:04
That is That's so funny. Good. I'm gonna ask you if you remember that. And, uh

spk_0:   21:08
oh, yeah.

spk_1:   21:09
So yeah, in Boston And I remember the song to which, because it's it makes the story that much better so we would have our headphones on and whatever the hell we were planted on two of the time, probably some like Discman or something, Right there was the NATO Connor. Nothing compares to you, right? So that the highest, the highest thing you could ever imagine. City. So the only guy who could hear it was a guy who was singing sweet, have the headphones on, and everyone else could Here, we couldn't hear the music. I still laugh about that lunch on the way to the ranks thing and Sinead O Connor to each other. My gosh. But that's the kind of stuff you remember, though, right? I mean, that's exactly yeah with that whole scenario. Like what? I've interviewed a few guys on this, and it's interesting when you went on to play 1000 games, you know? Congratulations. Amazing. I know that must have been Ah, riel. Big accomplishment. But like you did get the Stanley Cup finals, you played in olympics. Um, you know, you did some amazing, amazing things in your career. Where does that were to those two gold medals stack up as faras in ah, in the accolade system.

spk_0:   22:16
Oh, they're right up there. I mean, it's uh yeah, you see all? I did it. Go on and play a long time. And but as far as winning anything big, I think those are probably the last time Bianna championship like that. So it's, you know, whether you're doesn't matter what level when you win, it's It's a special feeling. So that's Ah, and I still got those gold medals in a special place in the house here, and those were those were those were huge. I mean, even when you look at that, you know the the excitement around the world juniors and being a part of it as a fan, now it's, uh it's exciting tournament to be kids at that age. It's some green memories coming back and thinking about those days.

spk_1:   23:01
No, it's awesome. It's really awesome and I mean, it's one. It's hard to make and to it's hard to win and uh, yeah for guys that, like I've talked to some guys and they just, you know, it really ranks up there. Israel special place. I think maybe more so for Canadians just because it is such a huge thing here, so it's really a part of our culture and a part of who we are kind of identifying at Izaki Nation and, um, and to be on the winning side of that and participate in that guy's always hold that really high. And I think that's special. Should be acknowledged because it's ah, cereal. Need thing to dio

spk_0:   23:30
100% sounds. Uh, yeah, Like we were sitting there talking now about some of the funny and it's a goofy stuff we did in those days to and the memories you have away from it. But get a group of guys like that together. Top players from across candidates, pretty unique and pretty special to be a part of that. So I 100% I agree with you.

spk_1:   23:53
Yeah. Mike. What? I was talking to him the other day. He was my lining there, And during that tournament, he's all gone Hold. He wants to get a reunion together. Of that T v C s O. You might make a phone call from him.

spk_0:   24:05
You sent a tweet out. Excuse me? He sent a tweet out about that. I didn't like a few times over the years to ease coaching now, and I see them a few years ago, but, uh, yeah, yeah, it's the same guys, even though it's funny. So my dad played some hockey back in the day pro hockey before I was around. But you still sees old buddies, and he always would say to us, You know, when you got your old buddies there, never they'll never go away. So it's coming back now because I see all my buddies from junior or even now that I've gone, been done playing pro or two. But you see these old guys, and it's like just to pick up where you, you know, the relationships you have, don't go, don't fade. So it's no pretty special.

spk_1:   24:50
It's one of the best parts of hockey, and that's one of the things you try and get through at the youth level. And even to the parents, it's like, Yeah, everyone. You mean you want? There's a goal, like whatever that goal is, it's different everybody. But you can't lose sight of what the sports for and what it's all about. India me, It really comes down to relationships and and ah, that aspect of the sports. Like you said, you mean we haven't seen each other for what, 20 some years? And you know, we could go down and have a beer and have some laughs and have some chuckles. And you have you share. There's something just in the DNA about that right that you get in there and you've done it and it's great. And that's a great aspect of the sport, too. So I'm glad you mentioned that before we get into the pro. I'd be I'd be remiss if I didn't talk a little bit about our lot. My last year of English was both of our last year's where you you knocked us out in the in the league finals in the league championships. Um, so for me personally, I mean, I was a special time because the 1st 1st year in Spokane's new Barn rights, we had that new Barnett that still just in an unbelievable junior facility and and we were the number one ranked team in Chl going into that playoffs, which you probably don't remember. But you guys had a great team, too, and you guys were ranked in the top 10 or maybe even up five. So we were. We were touted going into that as being the two top teams. But we ended up being down three games to nothing to Portland that year in the first round that Yeah. So we were down three games to nothing. I had to come back. We won game seven and over time. So, um, regards. What happened there? I know Daryn Sinclair scored it, OK? Terrence Sinclair scored that, Um I think I had won that game. But anyways, they got the big one, and Ah, and yes. So we're gonna be your history making anyways, right? Cause no one had ever done it. I don't think anyone still has done it. Come back down from three. Nothing in WHL toe win. No. Which means hard to do, right. But, I mean, it was the perfect storm because we were the better team. We were turned it into a hot goalie there at the start. We have to get her feet from underneath us. Maybe said we end up going on and playing you guys and I was personally on fire that, like that whole playoffs. It was just sort of one of those things. We came back from World Junior that year and I think I got a little bit of confidence from that. Andi just was rolling. I had like 21 goals in 15 games going into that you guys and had a couple of good games and Brandon and then and then I got shut down. I totally remember the you guys came back to spoke. A short handed breakaway went to go top glove on Lehner, who was later write. Lehman, layman, layman, right, hit the post on him in any way that I couldn't score the last three games, and we ended up losing and five to you guys. But, um, like that was a good run for me. I know you guys have been to the Mortal Cup the year before, but what was that like? You mean winning that championship, you know, and moving on

spk_0:   27:31
while I just mentioned before, like winning the World Juniors. But then that's different, even from winning the league championship like that League championship. That's still such a, you know, just the grind to go through to get their toe win. You know what? We have to go through three or four rounds of playoffs and spend the whole season you know, it's It's such a special thing when you're with those guys all year long. I vividly remember that hole playoff run to and even leading up to it. I think the last, including the playoffs. We had a 23 game winning streak, and so we one like we swept the 1st 2 rounds. Then we won the 1st 2 games around three, and then we lost to against Prince Albert, but leading to that. So that's 10 games and ending. We won that last 12 games of the season, too. So we had a really good team and then yeah, nor it was. I remember the first game and against you guys we won in overtime at home. Our it was over time. Then we lost one. Nothing game, too. The way had that, the way they had that set up was, uh, if we split the 1st 2 games Game three stays and Brandon, so we'll play a Game three and Brown and win that and then yeah, we come back to win game four and five and spoke

spk_1:   28:52
and spoke. That was really pointing for us to not be able to win win there, but That's where it goes sometimes,

spk_0:   28:57
But no. I mean, yes. So awesome. Like, obviously you are on the other end of it. But, I mean, for me, it was, uh, when you win a championship like that, that was my last real champion are only riel championship. I guess you could say toe win that Western League championship. So

spk_1:   29:15
not the tough league man to That's hard. Don't need to wake. Yes. Yeah. You know, I was just looking at you mentioned Brian McCabe Who, uh, who actually got in touch with the other day. And I'm glad he's still doing well and involved with the Florida Panthers there. But amazing career played with him for two years and in Spokane. And then I noticed that my memory is crazy bad when it comes to stuff like that. But he got traded and he was on that team that beat us, right?

spk_0:   29:38
No. No. So he was, uh, the year before we got him

spk_1:   29:43
the year before. Okay? And that's when you went to the Royal Cup. That that year?

spk_0:   29:46
Yeah. You lost. Kamloops was hosting that year, and we lost to them in the league final and then get we got a burst to the moral Cup because we're the Western lead grip. Representative. We didn't win the league, but we're finished second to them, so I'm going that year. But Labour came to a site year last year. Junior moved on.

spk_1:   30:08
Okay, so he must Okay, so my memory isn't that bad. I got my I got my date strong in a DBM. Like I don't remember playing the gates caper like that. Remember, he would have been

spk_0:   30:17
trading. You would have been trading year,

spk_1:   30:21
right? No, 100%. I was like, why would we have traded him back here? I was like, actually doing the mental math and like that was a port. Poor decision. But I'm glad we didn't trade a hell of a player. And then he was. I just remember going against him in practice, like one. You mean he was good, But to that was back in the days where you could stick your stick, he could stick my his stick. Handle that. Oh, my God. It was

spk_0:   30:45
out here. He was an artist

spk_1:   30:47
using art. And why wouldn't you be right? Like that's such a great way to slow guys up Oh, my God. I'm so glad they took that away. But, I mean, that was the area that we played in, right? Like trying to get around in a defenseman, and they could do whatever the hell they almost wanted. Teoh. Uh,

spk_0:   31:01
well, I even laughed in those days to the Fords. And the deer is always a constant. Not a few match, but back and forth just because holding up remember guys and dump it in. If the four didn't hold the guy up, he would be all mad. There's no holding up anymore. It's like, Yeah, obviously with the hooking in the holding. But I still remember that this global sports and defense usedto have about not holding out for folding now.

spk_1:   31:29
And you just go for a water ski to you could hold up all day long.

spk_0:   31:32
Now do that. You're going to hear from you.

spk_1:   31:36
Yeah, exactly. Know that's money. What? I was always mad at you guys. You guys never e I thought your you should have went and won the damn thing and he made us like those guys made us look bad. They should have. They should have went on to do. Did you run into something there? They didn't expect to get it just kind 100 performer. What do you What's your memory of the royal couple of that year?

spk_0:   31:53
Well, that year we went to Peterborough. And then, um yeah, we So both years we lost in the semi final of the tournament and remember losing a Peterborough it when we were there. And it was a tough game, I think. I don't know. I don't remember the details of it, but I remember the roughing was a little suspect. And so I'll use as this excuse, but

spk_1:   32:21
yeah, French referees. That was a problem. Former

spk_0:   32:25
homer referees way didn't play our greatest there. To be honest, we kind of, you know, after riding the high and being on that wave of, you know, this, that feeling you have when you know you're gonna win. Think we kind of lost that a bit And then we ran into, like Granby ended up winning that year. They had not really Well, Georgia Rock was on their team. Um, I can't remember all the names, but Jason, Jason Dwight was on that France swab. Brilliant. Okay, Played a long time. Yeah, little defenseman right, little defenseman? Yeah, use their captain

spk_1:   33:02
and I fought him when he was in Montreal's farm team.

spk_0:   33:05
They used little buggers and then But they had a but they had a really good team. I can't remember who else, but as far as four words, they had some guys that could score. But they had a good team, and they went, ended up winning it. But disappointing because, yeah, we got to go there. And just the disappoint part, I guess, was that I don't feel like we played our best. So right? No, but that's the way it goes.

spk_1:   33:31
Do you move on from there? And actually, I will cover a brief because I think we have in common is that we both got traded for Kirk Muller at one point.

spk_0:   33:38
Jews? Is that something?

spk_1:   33:41
Is that a trivia question? So I know you're part of that 33 player are three team deal, which, which kind of swapped first and second round picks there. When? When Ah Brard went to the island. You originally drafted by the island and you went to auto on and yeah, and mother was involved going to Toronto that I was the guy that was traded for Muller from Florida at the deadline. I think that two years later so way share that

spk_0:   34:04
you went to Toronto.

spk_1:   34:06
I went to Toronto. Yeah, from Florida. So I was, which is a really impactful point in my career. It was kind of interesting. I want to touch on that a little bit when you end up going to New York because it's just something different about going to a different place. Um, yeah. Ah, it was a little obviously way different for me. It was my first year pro when it happened to me. And you were you were well into your career at that point, but, um, yeah, so what? That tonight? A little bit later. But I want to talk about you getting into Ottawa. So you mean you're coming out of WHL? You have a great run. You go to Memorial Cup. Um, you are. You had a letter on your chest there. And Brandon, uh, second overall pick. How was it stepping in there? And what were your expectations after that Memorial Cup? Did did you Did you feel confident that you're gonna make that team? You think that was where you're gonna end up.

spk_0:   34:52
I did. Yeah, I guess. I mean, I think in my mind, that's, um I know, I guess I spend the one training camp with the island. There's I knew I wasn't ready at that point, um, to play in the NHL. And I was looking forward to getting back to Brandon and, uh, having that year Junior, which ended up being, you know, a really good year for me. And then, um yeah, and then I guess over that year, getting traded daughter, one kind of realizing and talking to my agent, knowing what was happening in Ottawa as far as the way the organization was changing. And they had a think There's like 12 new players on the team when I got there. There is a lot of young guys, a lot of draft picks that were starting their careers. Guys like Yashin dig Alfredson and just want to call the trophy. Radek Bonk was another topic. So there's, you know, some guys coming in there and you know, some excitement around it. So, no, I guess my mindset going in there was to make the team and ended up being like the fifth game of the year, Shawn Hill and Stand ness. Cash was another high prospect that played a few years before me, but they both blew their knee out in Game six of the season. And so I was probably gonna be a guy that would have been in and out of the lineup obits at the start, for sure, and had to earn my way. But these 22 of their top six guys went down and kind of opened the door, and I ended up playing every year, every game that season and had a good rookie year. And, um, I think the mentality with Doc Martin and his his approach was really good for me as he was a patient guy. And we're a young team and we had to work hard for everything we got. But, uh, so it was good for me. It kind of be able to learn by making a few mistakes, and my game was pretty efficient. But, you know, I was given opportunity to do things, and, uh, you know, I really, really appreciated that to be We have the opportunity because, um, you know, that's all you asked for, and I tried to make the most of it.

spk_1:   36:56
Yeah, that's interesting. You mean and everyone sort of has that little story. And like you say, maybe maybe you have been in and out, Or maybe you know, not quite of a bigger role, but also, an injury happens. You're able to step in, um, and take it, banjo, which is huge. Uh, I wanted maybe dig in a little bit of what you say with the shock Martin there and, like, may be able to make a few mistakes. And being patient, that was that. Was there a message to you like, did you feel that you you couldn't make a mistake? I know I've been in environments where I felt like people, and maybe it was just me, but I felt like people were watching. And they're watching for the mistake more than their watch for something good and assumes that mistake happened. They were looking for a reason toe not play again. Did you ever feel that there was that the opposite?

spk_0:   37:35
No. I was the opposite. I didn't feel that, and I I had have gotten that feeling and other up in other situations. And it's a terrible feeling. And I hate coaches that operate that way. Like just let a guy like because you're going to get the best out of a player by just letting them be themselves and play their game. And, um so I've never, never really understood that approach of some coaches that are just on all over guys for no good reason. Some guys a little more emotional on the others, whatever. But no, Jack was not that way. He demanded a lot, and he wanted you to work and and compete. And you had to do all that, obviously. But, uh um, you know, it's a game of mistakes and they got a and I think the thing to you. Yeah, you're going to get the most sort of guys. And obviously it's some guys air gonna be there some art. But you got to give guys freedom, Teoh and confidence just to go play and then do their thing toe. No, show what they can dio.

spk_1:   38:41
Sure, there's a fine line there to in your first stepping into that lead cause there's so many you know, there's so many elements that are beyond just the type of hockey your plan. Right, Mimi, near your in a league, you're in a city like for the first time, probably in your life. That's like a real city. You're you're you're playing against guys that you've probably had their posters on your bedroom wall growing up. You know, you're you're doing all these things that are new. And now you've got to try and navigate the game, which is the only thing that you're kind of feeling comfortable about or should be. And then if you're an environment where you feel you can't make a mistake, it makes it hard, right? Because you're to make some, you know. And the question is, how quick can you get comfortable in that environment? How was that? As far as your first you said, You said you played all 82 which is amazing. Um, was there Was there a few kind of big guy moments? I'm sure there were, like, where you're like, I can't believe him on the ice with this guy or like, what were your sort of ah ha's of that of that year?

spk_0:   39:35
Yeah, well, I even go back to my first camp with the Islanders and playing an exhibition game and MSG. I took a two on one. Ryan Graves and Messy were coming down on me as 18. And I can still look up and must have been in the second period. But I was my always My recollection is I look and just like everything just kind of like in a fish eye view or something. I could see the bright lights from the scoreboard above and those two guys coming down on me. But, um definitely some moments like that where, um yeah, I mean, Gretzky was still in the league then and Messi a those guys with the Rangers. Lamu. There's I have a few few pictures of guys like Lemieux's, I think hadn't retired whatever he was in his stage of his career. But, uh, yeah, it, uh, it's it. It's pretty amazing when you think about it. And being a young guy playing against these guys is pretty huge thrill.

spk_1:   40:37
No, that's really wild. That was something I wish I had a little more time there to try and get over because I was It was a big guy moment for me, right? It was It was it was that idea of like am I really supposed to be on this ice kind of feeling, right? And it's like, Wow, Right. And it and it again, Like you never know how much opportunity to get or how many games you're gonna get our You know how long that that that rope is? But ah, you know, I think it's a little bit different Every but I know your demeanor. You seem like a really, like a low, low pulse guy, you know? And did you there? I don't know if that is it. Some guys look that way and they aren't. But do you feel like that is the way you were in that? That you're kind of makeup Help you navigate that a little better? Yeah,

spk_0:   41:18
I guess so. I mean, that was always my game was, uh be efficient. Make the simple play was nothing flashy. Um, be I think, Yeah, my mind. I mean, this far is perfect preparation and being ready for the game. I think I took a lot onus to not and just making sure my mind was where it needed to be. And, um, you know, to play that way to play that game, Teoh, But Yeah, it's funny when you think about the grind of what it takes to be a that level to stay at that level like you can't get cut off from that stuff. And as much as you would like to enjoy the moment and ah, you know, take it all in your ear, focused on your next shift kind of thing, like I mean, to get over the fact. I mean at the start, it's like anything, the first little while, like the first part of my career. It's like adrenaline and are just excitement Carignon. And then you got to kind of get into a routine and a rhythm of what's going to make a successful and, um, toe Look back now. And, uh, sometimes I look back now and I kind of wonder if I even did all that stuff or played up. Played hockey for that long. It's just kind of Ah, you know the mindset when you're in, it's just more like day to day. You're just focused on the grind in the battle and and trying to get yourself a at a top level. And it's not even I wouldn't say it's always enjoyable, but uh, you know, that's just what you do. And at the end of the day, there's always those high moments, like winning big games or scoring. I mean, you have those those big thrills, and but it's it's a lot of work and preparation that goes into the to get in those things one

spk_1:   42:55
100% and think preparations a huge thing. And a lot of these young guys Now, um, you kind of learn that, you know, you are not to be a pro, I think, you know, and, uh, and whether it is in the NHL or the H l or any place for their Panya, you know, like there is there is something to that. How did you learn about that like that? What was your process of becoming a pro? It was there somebody there in Ottawa that helped us from a mentorship role. When it does, you kind of navigating it yourself for you mean walk us through. How How you how you learned that? Yeah,

spk_0:   43:26
Well, I think you look back at the Western Hockey League. It's ah, that was a bit of an education to and the way we're coached in the way the league is. I mean, that's you could call that pro hockey pretty easy to just here at the rink every day, years, you know, there's demanding to which was great. You know, when I learning process obvious. Not quite the level of a pro situation, but that's really there was the approach. And Brandon, we came to rink. We were pushed hard. We had to compete every day in practice games, you know, preparation where everything was done the same way. So when I got to the pro level is obviously the same, we had, uh, remember a sports psychologist worked with our team for the long time in Ottawa. Pretty much my whole time in auto. Our Jacques Martin Johnny Failing was his name, and he was a professor at Queen's. He is also play. Thank you's the captain for the national rugby team. So here's a tough guy. Awesome, dude, but he'd come and work with us and talk about get up presentations probably three or four times a year. Just getting mentally You know what it takes, how to prepare, how to visualize how to do all these things, you know, to keep your game at a high level and really get the most out of yourself. So I still have a lot of those handouts, and I still think a lot about those tips and advice of what it took and what did you needed to do? And everyone's different. Everyone does their own thing. But, um, no, he really helped me with that for sure. Um, yeah, Just all boat coming, being prepared, doing the things that you need to do to be ready. And, um and that's a big part of it.

spk_1:   45:16
Just taking a quick break from the conversation to remind you that the best way for you to support this show is to go to wherever you get your podcasts and try and review, try and raid it and share it. Subscribe. That is the way we convey. Get more eyeballs on the podcast so we can get the value here in front of more people. So if you are listening, if you are enjoying the content and the program and the guests that I'm able to bring out, that would be an amazing way for you to support is just, like, shared. Subscribe. Ah, once again, I appreciate you taking the time. It doesn't take much time, by the way, if never done it before. It's legitimately less than a minute. So if you can take that time would be much appreciated. Now back to the conversation with Wade Redden. No, that's great. I'm glad you glad you mentioned that I had an amazing interview with Danny Briere. Hey, was one of my first guests on and talking about his journey from the mind miners where he was doing great and was the first of round pick and all the rest of it. But he had a really hard time figured out how to be an NHL player, and he talked really vulnerably about his time with the sports psychologists and how, like everything that he was doing off the ice ended up transitioning into a position of confidence on the ice for a fellow key. Belong. Then it was all you mean, you know, I could any specific details, but I mean that word preparation is huge, right? And it's like what you want to do when you're when you're not with your skates on right. That that makes a big difference for a lot of guys, and I do want to get into it. So I think now you're sort of dealing with some of that stuff with players in Nashville on that side, right? And it's something that I don't know

spk_0:   46:55
Thio was doing that. I didn't do that this year, but three years doing it for sure.

spk_1:   47:01
Okay, awesome. Yeah, I love it. We love it. I love to get into that. I find that really interesting because that is something that I'm helping guys with now is is that, like you said, you said it a couple times. The mindset is such an interesting word, right? It means different things to different players. It takes a mind set to be a pro. It takes a mindset to become your best and and to fulfill kind of your potential. And I think in some aspects, that was where I felt that I was missing some things right. Like taking an opportunity or really understanding how to step into the moment, right? Have being confident in situation where maybe you haven't earned the confidence, right? That's a really interesting thing right up in an environment where you've never actually had results before. And there is Ah, there's a mindset to that. And there's a process to that which I have learned now after in which I love talking about, because it's such a powerful thing, right? And it's interesting for me to hear you still remember the sports psychologists that you talked to 34 times a year and that had an impact on you. And you have the handouts, right? Obviously Right, obviously something that helped you.

spk_0:   47:58
Oh, for sure. And yeah, when you mentioned the fact that I know I just did three years of player development and I stepped away from it this year with Nashville. But that was that's kind of the biggest meshes hours had was What do you doing away from the ring? Because it seems like these kids nowadays, when it gets too on the ice, they're all talented. They all can handle the park and shoot the parking. Um, no hockey sense. Whatever it's, it's a thing, too. But, you know, what are you doing away mentally, Teoh to make sure you're ready, because, I mean, that's a big part of it. Just we always talked about the apex like I'd have to look at the handle again, but he had kind of a graph. Where is like your emotional side of physical? And then there's like there's a There's a zone there where you want to be right, like the apex of all these things and and how do you get to that? Um so it's really interesting and really work can be done. Teoh, get yourself because, um, I mean having your mindset. We talked about that. It's hard to explain, really. But, um, you want toe be away from the rank. You you won't have a balanced life. You want to do all these things toe to be happy, to be whatever fulfilled and when. So when you get to the rink, everything's clear. Everything's open your mind. Your body is always just focused on that one thing. So, um, it's, uh, yeah, it's It's a big process, and some guys do it better than others, and it takes a learning process toe figure things out for each individual, but I believe that that's a big part of your performances. Is having your mind in the right spot?

spk_1:   49:44
Yeah, 100%. Um, I coaches play a big part in in teams and individuals. Did you have any coaches that were influential for you or anyone's that maybe you didn't get along with their journey like highs or lows in that department. When you when you look over the coaches that you were a part part of,

spk_0:   50:06
uh, well, I wouldn't say didn't get along with any. I always tried to work with people And do you know, respect what they did and stuff? Definitely. I guess when I look back in my career in Ottawa, Jack was was really good to me. Perry Pearn was there my whole time to, um, there's a few different other assistant coaches. Craig Ramsay was an awesome, awesome guy. He had played a long time. He was kind of, Ah Selke, Trophy guy with Buffalo for years and really had a great demeanor and and, uh uh, personality and sense of humor and stuff. And I really look back and some of the little talks I used to have with him and and he used he was a quiet guy, but he just had a way of connecting and kind of knowing what your mind was going through. So he was able to help me a lot in a few different situations where not struggling, maybe, or just simplifying things. Stuff like that. Um, I played for John Tortorella in New York, and I really feel like I would have had a much I would have been really enjoyed him at a different time in my career. I kind of like the energy abroad and and stuff like that. I was kind of my play was going down, and so he was hard on me and it wasn't a great situation, but, uh, I know a lot of it. He's really stood up for me a lot of situations to do. So, um, so you know, different relationships, different situations kind of have different memories of each guy, but But I tried to get, you know, sake take you, learn a lot from all these guys. That's they have different styles and different approaches. And I

spk_1:   51:47
mean, that's a mindset right there to that you're talking about, you know, because there is. You can ask questions of, you know, wise in this working for me, or why doesn't this guy like me reading ask the question of What can I learn from this or what? What can I do differently? or how can I get better? Right. So the same situation, two different questions and your brain's gonna start looking for different answers, right?

spk_0:   52:07
Yeah. Yeah. And it's all perspective. I mean, I think touching on my time in New York, it was kind of a tough time in my career because I just signed a big deal there in my you know, I hadn't. So my mom just passed away. I moved from Ottawa to New York. Big change, and I just I could feel it almost. My mind wasn't like I talked about being at the top of my game and auto on those, you know, there was, you know, in my best years of my career, then going there, and I could just I didn't maybe acknowledge it as much. That's where I look back and kind of say, he's If I would just want that NIST would have done that. I could feel it. But I didn't act on it than us. And so that my game continued to kind of spiraled down.

spk_1:   52:58
What were you feeling when you say you felt it? Like what? What what? What does that mean?

spk_0:   53:02
Uh, well, I think physically I I was just I think it was mostly I think a lot of it was just dealing with. I want to say with my mom and stuff like that, and I tried to just keep going and doing the same things. I was always doing that to get myself ready, and it just wasn't working the same. And I think I should have just taken a stop in a pause and and deal when I talk about before. Having your mind in a good place away from the rink allows you to get to the rink and be it at your top level. And I think, you know, I should have heeded those words back then and done some things differently and just taking a pause and slow things down a bit. And, um, but as as this life goes, I mean, you're in a year in the day to day, you're going, you're grinding you You got to get ready for the next year. And I just tried to keep plowing through and it didn't didn't work out that well for me. Toe be at my best. So

spk_1:   54:02
you do but one.

spk_0:   54:04
Yeah, you do the best you can and you tryto you think you're doing the right things. But, you know, I would have done things differently

spk_1:   54:13
because it's it. There's lots of things. I mean, you talk about the New York scenario and I've never I've never signed a big ticket. You signed. You signed a relatively big ticket. That two year deal right before. So you had you had, Ah, big money deal. But you signed that big money deal in a comfortable environment with a team that you've been with for 10 years. Like I I think that there's a little bit of a comfort there, right? I think there's a little bit different and then and then and tell me if I'm wrong. But I like to sign as a free agent now a really big ticket going to a really big market. Ah, there has to be some level of like, wow, you know, like, what's next? Or how am I going to react in this scenario or like it was any of that going on for you as well at that time?

spk_0:   55:01
Well, yeah, I guess. A little naive going to New York and understanding the fan base. And what happens there and and just that's I mean when So when I did my first interview, I remember doing a press conference going over the phone with them, and they're talking about the next Brian Leetch. Like, run the power plan like I didn't say anything. I'm like, I'm not really the same players Brian Leetch here. So I don't know if that's obviously they expect taste when you come in making a lot of money and, um and then you know, Then I talked about all the other stuff that was going on with me, and I just I just didn't feel I gave myself the best opportunity for success there. So, um but yeah, it's Ah, yeah, that's demanding spot New York. And then I get there and things weren't going great and the fans get on the end. It was like, Oh, my God, what the hell of my into here was a great great feeling at all. So ended up you're obviously getting sent down to the miners. Spend a few years there, and I was actually ended up again. I try to take it. It was actually a breath of fresh air. To be honest to get out of that situation And the Golden Miners was a bit of a kick in the in the pants. But, you know, I kind of swollen my pride. Actually, the first call I got was from Brad McCrimmon. He was a great kind of mentor. His brother Kelly was my GM and junior. But no, no, he was is great to hear from. A lot of people reached out and knew the situation was going through. So I had a lot of help and support stuff and end up going down the Hartford. I'm a few good years. I've enjoyed my time there. No, um, and kind of got the You had some fun again.

spk_1:   56:44
It seems like getting back to the big contract thing. And sometimes guys their first couple years, they don't do well with the big contract. And it's not, You know, you're definitely not alone in that scenario. And a lot of times Likas faras, the media or the fans portrayed. It's like, Oh, you know, cushy or whatever. They got their money, and now they're not trying anymore. And like, first of all, I think that's bullshit. And I think it's super unfair because you don't get that contract from being like that, right? I mean, you put in the time you do the work, so I think first of all, that's not fair. But I think I think the side of you talked about is like that. I just think that there would be another level of expectation on yourself and from the organization and from fans. And like, the stuff you're talking about that really changes the game a bit for you. It has to change the game a bit for you. Then you You load on that. Now, your mother, who is obviously one the most important people in your life has passed away. And now you're trying to do with all this and and at a time physically, when you're getting a little bit older and you're dealing with some of that

spk_0:   57:39
stuff like it,

spk_1:   57:40
it might not be the perfect recipe. And it's nothing to do with whether you want to or not, right? It's just it's just psychology. A lot of it at that point, right?

spk_0:   57:49
Yeah. And no eso When I do look back on that situation, that hole time, my life, you know, obviously I would I would have done some things differently. It's a learning process to go. And I'm, um you know, as much as it kind of, Yeah, I'm not bitter boat or anything like that. They look back on it kind of, You know, I wish I would have done things differently. Basically, I guess it call it regret. Call it what you will, but it happened, and I learned a lot from it. It's kind of an experience that's no, it is what it is, kind of things. No, no, no. But yeah, like all those things you said it was kind of, Ah, it just There's a lot lot going on and and as there is a lot going on in everyone's life and everyone's career and you've got to find a way to navigate through it and and and get the best So I mean, I was a professional occupy layer. It all comes down performance on the ice and you got to do whatever it takes tow, get yourself ready. And that's I guess, really, a lesson that that I learned a lesson. I tryto you know, when talking with you and the kids you talk to, That's really? What it comes down to is how do you get the best performance out of yourself? Yeah, You know, there's different. Obviously, people get older and you don't know there's, You know, when you get older in your career there, it's just kind of it happens where you slow down and stuff like that. But, um,

spk_1:   59:18
do you think as faras uh, I think of myself personally like I told you, is gonna maybe dig into that story a little bit? But like when I got traded for Muller, I was I was sleeping in my apartment in Greensboro, North Carolina. I'd played 19 games with the Panthers in my rookie year Pro. They had sent me down, but it was like, you know, they were really great about it, you know, they're like, Hey, you're part of this thing, right? This is just, you know, this is best for you, Development. Right now you're gonna be here like don't worry. And in my head, I was like having to be afford accounted for 10 years, right? Like and so I was down. There was a point, a game guy in the minors, and then the phone rings and the trade deadline day, and I get traded to Toronto. And, um, so I left from, like being in the NHL City like that's not a hockey city to being in the Bay Police stress room with, you know, when No Clark and Matt Sundeen and like nobody that I knew at all, right? Like 20 to you guys I've never met in my life coaching staff. I've never been to camp with those guys, right? So I went from, like, a different league to the best week. You city? Yeah, in Toronto, right in the same 20 reporters and like and I felt like at that time, like I had an agent, Mike Burnett, who was one of the most respected guys going but, like, what is he gonna tell me? He said, Good luck, Jace. You know, like I was. So I was in this environment at 21 going like I felt like it was just me, and it was just me. And that's one thing that I kind of regret is like, I wish you would have surrounded myself with, asked more questions or, like had a support group like, because it's hard to navigate you know. I mean, I don't know. You're you're talking about stuff now. May be your biggest adversity was at the end of your career there 30 or whatever, But do you Did you feel that time that you were You had someone around you that you could talk to you or what? Help you through that. Or were you doing it by yourself?

spk_0:   1:0:57
Uh, no, no, I just got married too. So she was. My wife was awesome and is very good. It's, you know, a great support system, obviously. And so add her. My agent was big for me, dining me and but, like you say, like as much as you go to Tron or the hotbed of the hockey world. But your loan, like that's what I find a lot of these kids to like, as much money as much notoriety or whatever. At the end of the day, you go home to an empty apartment. You're single guy. It's a lot of loneliness, too. And that's that's 100% what I would have felt, um, as a young guy that you would have felt, and I don't know if the ages change, kids reach out more they're more connected. Maybe it's the technology, whatever. But you didn't have anyone. You could just texter, you know, you weren't on instagram. I don't know stuff like that like, yeah, there's a it's loneliness and, um and not understanding. In those days, no one reached out. You just kind of sucked it up. You did what you had to do. Everyone was toughed it out. Right. But, you know, I think that's when you the mental health, you know, supports and stuff like that. People understand more about what kids are going through and what people are going through. When you need help, you need supports. And, um, that's probably one thing I was bad at. Two is reflecting on my feelings and understanding what you're going through because that you just focus on the next game and you just kind of bury whatever is going on and OK, we'll practice. Okay, I will get ready for the game. But you didn't really that dig too deep Pinto what the real issues were. So I think that was the older guy now and you've got kids. You really tryto understand what you're feeling what's going on because that's like I said again that at the end of the day, you get those things and order your games going to flourish

spk_1:   1:2:59
right when I even value. May I talk to guys now and like, I think there's massive value in the value of experience, meaning somebody else has done it before. Someone else has been there, and I think team a lot better that now of incorporating that. Like I heard the Bruins like they assign almost like one of the older guys, whether it's char or Bergeron to like some of these younger guys coming in. So there is there is that communication, right? Like I encourage guys now is young guys to ask questions right? Like it. It's OK toe to say, Hey man, and I wasn't that guy right? And then I was environments to where the leaders weren't really guys that would come in, sit society and say, Hey, how's it going, kid? You know, we're like what's going on and so bad on me and bad on that, But like I think when that starts coming together, right and then you start feeling more a part of it and then it's not like there's nothing wrong with you like everyone has emotions and feelings and has done a certainty and they're wondering about. But, like, if you can have, like, a guy or a person are something that can just make things a little bit simpler, a little bit clear, it helps. And, uh, I don't know. I mean, did you feel yourself grow into that role or even maybe, when you're in the minors that make you in a in your chest? I mean, for the Stanley Cup finalist team, right? So you know, there is leadership qualities about you for sure. Was that something that you tried to make people coming in feel comfortable?

spk_0:   1:4:20
100%? I always felt that is that way. Even in junior. When? Because I remember guys that power. That's right. You call them. These guys try to be tough than they be hard on the rookies. And I never understood why you'd want to do that. Yeah, I kids got a earn their stripes, and they got in the respect, but I was always make him feel comfortable. Bring him in like talk to him and and and even my role with the pat, like even all the Every team now has player development guys, and that's really what it's all about. Two like you come in, here's a young kid, gets drafted and then on my role. Eyes obviously experience and played a long time. So I'm gonna talk to this guy. I'm going to make him feel comfortable. He almost coddling that some points. I'm still got the old school mentality where they've got a tough it out to. But, you know, you make it easy for these guys to come in and play their game and make him feel comfortable. So when they do come to the training camp or they're not just wide eyed and like scared, basically, you know, you want him to come in and be comfortable and play their game, and you know when you see it. Now kids, young young kids 18 1920 year old pics that come in and are stars in the NHL. So I think that's a big part of it, too, is just have him come in and feel they can be themselves. And just so I was always that way, even when he got in Ottawa. You know, rookies come in, you bring him in, make him feel part of it. And and, uh, you know, that goes a long way.

spk_1:   1:5:54
No. 100%. I've heard it again and again. My mind. One experience that has shared in the show before. What the end of my career? I tried out for the Red Wings, and that was when Babcock was there and Holland was still there. And I had a relationship with Babs from from Spokane and and I was going to give her another kick at the can. And, uh, it was just such an amazing experience because I felt I felt like I belonged in that environment. Yeah, and it was like the least likely of me to make that a team ever right. I was 29 years old. I just come back from Europe and let me It was kind of like a has been almost right, but I felt like I could play there, and I felt like the guys like belt made me feel like I could play there and just being a part of that culture of, like, togetherness where everyone is a part of this thing was like nothing that I felt anywhere else. That I was in my in my pro career and and when I interviewed guys like, you know, Brad Larson I've had on the show and he talked about his time with Colorado and how everything was about when he met Stanley Cup and the guys at the top knew that 1/4 liner like Brad had to feel like the most important player on the team. And he said there was time to reach more like the most important player on the team, right? They just knew how to talk and how to bring guys up. And, um, you know, so good for you to do that because, my God, you might have made some careers there. Two. By doing that, you know, like that's

spk_0:   1:7:06
that's the thing, right? And that's I mean, I don't claim to be the one to do it always. But as Faras, like a team setting a team culture team personality, I don't know, like every year, talk to Mo Colorado in Detroit, Red Wings, who were the better teams, and those are in our days, right, like thes the teams that were successful in one Stanley cops and Joe Sakic and Steve Eyes, Um and I don't think you find two better people in the hockey world and those guys and those are the people leading the charge in that mindset. And then you look at some of the organizations that stumble and struggle, and he just, you know, you wonder what how things air operated there and and I don't get all starts with, like, you see, treating people the right way. And, um, and Lars, Well, we're all in the same world Junior team there. So and Hughes, same same type of guy, same person that's, you know, a team guy. And, uh, yeah, it's funny to hear him talk that way, too. So it's not surprising that, you know, these teams are success that do, because just the way they treat their people in the way they bring everyone together.

spk_1:   1:8:22
Yeah, when you talked about towards do and said, you know, you wish things would have been better there, but that's where Brad coaches with him now. And he just says he's like the way the culture that he has there and how much he cares for his guys. And he learned so much from towards every day and he ah you know, and that is the culture. It's a caring culture, right? Do you have to believe the guys care about you? And I think that's That's maybe a little bit of a difference from when we started coming in the league that instead of being, you know, perceived his assets. Maybe is the right word to use. Like you're considered people on your part of something bigger than then, you know, then just whatever going on the ice. So it's interesting. I like watching that, actually, evolution of the game and how guys there are treated Now what dumb I want to talk about the Olympics and and and the leadership aspect of that. Because me, me, you go to something like the Olympics. I mean, wow, first of all, like what a cool experience and be recognized one of the top defenseman in in Canada, like amazing. Congratulations on that. It wasn't Ah, how is that whole experience playing with that group of guys in that environment? Um, you know, it just must have been so many. I just could have been a sponge in that environment, I'm sure.

spk_0:   1:9:32
0 90%. So I played on a few different. Well, obviously from World Junior some world championship. I played on the World Cup team and old floor. So a lot of the same guy is you kind of get to know these guys, and it's a lot of the same players on these teams. But, yeah, the Olympics was special, like you had to be named to that and to go to it. It was a disappointing tournament for a group, but, uh, you know, just to be a part of that was so excited and highlight of my career. Who were the guys? I guess. Looking back, Hank Niedermayer was hurt, so he serviced him not being at that tournament. But Pronger and Blake and cable was there. Uh, no. As far as OutFront we had, Sakic was the captain's lead and unbelievable. I mean, look at the team. I can't think of all the players on the roster because there's an unbelievable roster. And then, you know, Yeah, it was. It was the one thing I could say about Torino, Italy. It wasn't that great about set up when I looked four years later and watching the Vancouver Olympics in the excitement that was around that it was looked like a much different environment and and experience for the for the participants. But yeah, to say that went the Olympics. It's pretty cool. Pretty

spk_1:   1:10:49
similar to be a

spk_0:   1:10:49
part of that. What

spk_1:   1:10:51
was did that do that take precedence over the World Cup in your in your opinion?

spk_0:   1:10:55
Ah, yeah, would have. I think for sure it was, uh I ended up getting hurt in the World Cup to, So I didn't. I think I played two games of the tournament. It was kind of hanging around for the rest of it, which was fun, too. But, um but no, it was, uh, Olympics. And we got to see some other sports to which living in the village and doing that was kind of the experience of you. You remember a lot, too. And meeting some of the other athletes and there's actually, uh, an athlete. Choose a speed skater from Lloyd Minster Girl. Chrissy Myers is her name. So she was. Thank you. You're younger than me in high school, but she was on the speed skating team. So remember meeting up with her and when we all went over to watch some of the races and stuff. And, yeah, just to be around some of the other athletes who is pretty cool.

spk_1:   1:11:47
No, that's amazing. When you assemble, when you assemble 20 guys or 22 guys, that you are the best, the best of the best of the best, and you put him on a team. There's a lot of things that go along with that. I know when you put on when you put on that jersey for Canada, you know, egos. Eagles could go away, but sometimes they don't to, uh, but And the every guy in that room is a leader in his own right to probably on his own club team. Was there anyone that really just stood out to you is being like, Wow, this guy's got the DNA of of a leader. You mean this guy? This guy's somebody I want to follow?

spk_0:   1:12:23
Yeah, Actually, my partner was Adam Foote for a lot of that tournament. So he's a guy that no, I really kind of soak up in a you know, a guy that was in Colorado, one a few cuts by that time. And, um, you know, I really respected him a lot, So a guy like him, Um, but just gather mindset in just the way they talked in the way they operated in between periods or what they said. You know, he is obviously a leader on every team he's been on and in Colorado and want a lot of things. So I still remember some of the things is just the way he operated and how he acted. Um, you know, he stands out the most probably. But it was just kind of interesting to observe guys and see how they prepared or what they did t get ready. Um, you know, for big games it was it was interesting to kind of take some of the things they did and and try to better yourself to.

spk_1:   1:13:20
Yeah, that's really That's really cool. I could imagine next. Everyone has their own way, and even I'm getting into different biographies and stuff. And Kobe Bryant has been on the radar for obvious reasons here recently, and I've been I've been reading about him or and, uh, it's crazy. I mean, everyone has their own way in their own path, and maybe not everyone has a quite dialed in as well as others, but you can see it sometimes, right? And you can feel it when a guy when a guy hasn't that thing or that way about him and, uh, and how powerful that could be known within a team but with an organization. I mean, I I really think like the sea on a team is a big deal and sometimes ah, well, I don't know. I don't want to get any 15 specifically, but sometimes it's going to the best player, even at the NHL level when it's maybe not the best captain and, uh, e think that's that could be that could be problematic in a lot of ways. Um, did you do? Who in in Ottawa there watch you Will, somebody comes to mind is like Ciara So you played together with Ciara for for a while? Um, he ended up going Teoh Boston when it was the cap era issue That kind of to make a decision between the two of you. If I remember correctly, you end up staying in Ottawa, you go to that you understanding of final and the next year with the letter on your chest Cargoes office that Wayans winning a cup for five years later, and now it's still playing And now recognizes, you know, one of the best kind of all time. Maybe even, you know, in realms like, Did you see him in that way at that time when you guys were together or Seymour just appear?

spk_0:   1:14:49
Ah, well, no, I think so. He came to Ottawa over a year. Was that 99? And he hadn't really established himself? Yeah, he'd he had played a few years. I guess. What? The Islanders, which is an organization that kind of was stumbling and never really seem to get going in those days. But he came in and he Really? Yeah, Look, watch a guy and to see how he operates in just the preparation like this is a guy that was committed 100% worked out all the time was like, no nonsense guy. And, uh, yeah, he was really good for our group. And I remember even getting a chance because I went to Boston late at the end of my career, played a few games with them at the end, and just to be around him again and just the presence he has amongst Defense Corps, obviously, First but also the whole team and the way he leads just It's a no surprise Boston, so successful the way they are, because he's so committed and so dialed in and, you know, add to the fact his stature and the what he could do physically and stuff like that. You know, he's just a guy that makes it easy for everyone around him because he such a strong leader and does all the things and doesn't do 100% what it takes to be successful. So, you know, he was really good for our team in Ottawa, and, uh, it was unfortunate. I don't want to say they had to choose between the two of us. I wish that could have been a way to kind of keep him around, because obviously he is you. He's one of the best that's ever played on by so many great things. But

spk_1:   1:16:31
remember some guys talking about him, Red Sea like earlier that like he was like, I'm not really that good, like he had a hard time getting around note there. His hands were in great and and kind of evolved into this player, you know, like, and that's kind of why I was talking about him. Because you did have that you grew up with them, or you kind of grew up together, right? You guys, you guys established yourselves together, and then you had that, you know, he left and then you joined again. And then the second time you played with them was like when he was, at a way different stature level and on a different team. And I kind of thought that to be interesting for you to see that perspective of, like, playing with them at a younger age and then now, joining him again, being the Boston Bruins almost right. And what that would have been like,

spk_0:   1:17:12
Yeah, no, for sure. And by the time you left Ottawa, yeah, used one of the top guys in the league at that time he was. How many years did he play in Ottawa? Like it would have been five or six. And ah, but yeah, like I said, just the way he did prepare cause he probably was that player, and well, in junior, he got to the Islanders and yeah, he wasn't anything. He was a big guy and was strong, but just Yeah, I guess his workout that kind of got him to worry became a player like he was starting to make plays with the pocket member dangling around like he was just He wanted it so bad. I think that was his is thing. Two in the way worked in the off season. I was reading article about him. How he's kind of because his dad was a Greco Roman wrestler, right? 76 Olympics and Montreal, but talked about the work ethic and working smart. So Yankees catalogued every workout he's ever had since, like a mid nineties, and he has it all documented, all in organized. And he's just a riel, a stupid guy and really focused guy you got in the cycling monies in Ottawa. Curtis decision. I had brought that to the table cause Curtis was no unreal conditioned guy, too, and they started doing these road bikes. I think they both went did a couple. There's almost like experience. You can do it. The Tour de France. So they went and did this, which is like an elite elite bikers. It's not the Tour de France guys, but its charter was doing all this stuff and, um is here is his physical stature and ability was just off the charts. And, uh, any any really worked hard to get him and then the skill level, like he just became a player. Yeah, he's He's, uh he, uh he's one of the best.

spk_1:   1:19:05
I'm really drawn to those stories now of the guys that, like you mean talent is one thing. And, you know, I think you and I can both relate to that. And you know that your whatever your good or you're talented or your this year that Then there's the guys that maybe didn't have us high of ceiling on talent, but, like, did it with skill, right? Like you can you can train skill, you know, like you could develop skill and you can develop your talent and these guys that grow into being these these these beasts right of the sport. It's really, like a mastery mindset. Almost. And, you know, I think Charles just totally one of those guys that seems to fit into that, right? Like he just worked his way into the position that he was

spk_0:   1:19:45
Yeah. Yeah, and he, uh and I guess it's almost like ignorance ignorance but a belief that thank you. There's just no other option, right? Like that's all these. That's his focus. That's that's what he does. And I even put Alfredsson in that boat, too. I played a long time with him. He used the captain and Ottawa for a lot, pretty much all those years. And, um, but just a belief work ethic, like every year, every day in practice, there's a guy that would maybe, you know, the hardest working guy in the ice. He having the fun, too, and as far a skill level, they'd always play this game, and I never really got involved too much. I wish I would now, but he was always looking that get that extra advantage like and it ended up. That's just his personality. I think guys like that that that's the way they live their life, like they're always, whether you're playing a card game or a board game or Ping pong or basketball, whatever. They're always they gotta win everything right so they just have that mindset on Uh so being around guys like that, it's interesting and fund to kind of soak up and try to learn from guys like that.

spk_1:   1:20:56
You know, I never sent a man that and look at the culture of Ottawa there. I mean, it went from a losing franchise. And obviously, you get some guys in the locker room that, you know, one You're sitting there saying you're caring about guys right that are coming in. You got outfits and is leading the way. Was like workhorse chars coming in there, right? Doing this thing. Well, we start winning, right? I'm sure the other guys that are pieces of that puzzle, but I mean it that for culture starts I really believe that. You know, it's about the individuals and and caring about each other and doing a little bit extra right, pushing each other, trying to get better. I have a buddy. Ah, it was on your run there, Dean McAmmond, that the your rates, the final and eso. He lives here now, and he's use a coach here locally. Have been out one of his practices. A good guy would talk a little bit about that Run. You mean the line between winning it and losing it? Israel. Fine. Um, I know everyone. Everyone just wants to remember the Stanley Cup champion, and that's the way life works in the world. Works. But, you know, it's so close. They're like, What do you What's your take away from from that run there when you got to the final and lost to think it was Anaheim that year When when he was with you, right?

spk_0:   1:22:00
Yeah. Yeah. No, I was, uh, yeah, it was a special run. Very special time. My being in Ottawa on that whole playoff experience. Um, it's funny, though, to touch on it at the start like, yeah, you get all this way, you get right to the final, you lose. And then here you're watching TV and they're doing their parades. They're doing everything, and it's like nothing happened. Almost sort of losing team. It's like it's over and you have nothing to show for it. So that's that happened also in Poop Chute. That happened also in, uh, Eyes with Boston my last year, where they Chicago won the final and same thing, you just it's over. There's nothing there. But I guess looking back and any time in the playoffs was the best time of it. I mean, you always look forward to that time of the year, where it's spring time, the weather's turn and winters done. It's nice. So you're going to the rink with the windows down and playing big hockey games. There's there's no better feeling not. And then toe have some success to win those three rounds and have the fan this the excitement around the city. That was obviously the first time the organization got to that point. And, you know, we come back from remember winning? We won. It was an afternoon game when we beat Buffalo in the Eastern Conference finals. We get back, whatever. 56 in the evening, the sun shining. There's people lining the streets outside our where we landed our airplane and just the excitement around that and the people that, uh, knowing during our games that they kind of adopted the Red Mile thing to that Calgary. It started back in four, and I think they call this sends mild. But the whole street was shut down and, like everyone is so excited about it. So they know that that was going on. And you're a part of all that is is such a cool who experience And, um yeah, but at the end of it. When you don't win, it's like it all ends so abruptly and there's nothing to show for it. So it was disappointing, but at the same time, there's a lot of great memories. Some of those big games you think about overtime wins and and games were, you know, key situation than gains where, you know, we rose up and then got the job down. It's such a great feeling.

spk_1:   1:24:26
Yeah, it brings a team together and, e I bet you could probably name every guy in that team or if we're 90% of them right, It's just like there's something about those teams. Were you? You mean you have to come together to get that far? It's just That's the way it is. And I got goose bumps on my forearms when you're talking about it, the playoffs, because I for me, that's that was always what it was all about. You mean like, yeah, I mean, the Reagan season was fine, but it was no matter where you played, it was always a grind, right? It was like to get to the next one and you know, But then when the When your plan to play again and insist. Like you said, there's that certain flavor in the air and it's just a different time of the season. And and that was what it was all about when guys and that's where you saw the truth, the true mettle of guys to write. I mean, guys, guys come out there and it was, I don't know. I just always thought that about sports, the playoffs was always just the best, and, uh, and that was the biggest thing I missed. When I got out of the game, it was like I didn't mean Everyone says they missed the room. Of course I missed the guys, you know, like, but I got front buddies at home to Yeah, I mean, it's not like that wasn't the biggest thing, but it was like that competition level is what I missed, right? Like when you're when you are playing to play again, there's something special about that. And, uh, and I missed it. Me too. Um, your last year there when I when I was first up with Florida as a rookie. So that was when we got knocked out by you guys. So I got knocked out by you guys in Spokane, and then they called me up in Florida and Florida was in the playoffs, so you couldn't go anywhere. You're going the Memorial Cup and so floaters in the playoffs. And I was supposed to play when I when I landed. Ah, I had a practice. And then I was supposed to play the next day against the Bruins, so it would have been wrong NHL game. Ray Shepherd was hurt. I showed up for Ah, I had the pregame skate and I came into the room for the night, right to with my suit on everything else. And Ray Shepherd had some, like miraculous recovery like you during his pregame nap road. Every and and, uh and then I never saw the light of day again, right, Like that was the closest I got was a black case, the rest away. But that was the year they went to the finals like we went. Yeah, I was on the ice and Pittsburgh when we beat Pittsburgh and Game seven, right with the jury with a T shirt on and like and of getting swept by Colorado. But I mean, that was a really wild way to start my pro career right. I go into Stanley Cup final, is a black case and travel with the team and doing all that stuff. You played games there with Boston, but when you weren't planned, were you kind of in the black A sort of role or what was your role?

spk_0:   1:26:44
Yes, yes, basically, I So I started playing. I got hurt in game for against money in that first round against Toronto. So I separated my shoulder and then I miss Game five. I played Game six and then and then, Yeah, I couldn't go in Game seven. They ended up. I was a big comeback when they came back Leighton and ended up going. So Oh, that was kind of a coming out party for Torey Krug to end up scoring like I don't how many goals in the next round so that I never ended up getting back in. So I was kind of around and practicing, and it was like a month and 1/2 just kind of hanging out and watching and maybe getting a chance and trying to stay ready as much you can, but yeah, that was kind of the same role Black case and just just taken

spk_1:   1:27:36
black case in Boston's different than in Florida. We were playing volleyball and we had the best hands going. You should CEO

spk_0:   1:27:45
probably that more so.

spk_1:   1:27:48
It's but, um, good memories to wrap things up. I would love to talk about, he said, You're not doing with Nashville anymore, but it's definitely in line with what I'm doing now what I'm passionate about and that's, you know, the player development side and, like, the stuff that we're talking about getting guys ready. And how come guys guys be the best they can be and have the careers that they want? And how did that one year was? So, Scotty Nicholas there. So, Scotty Nickel do I have to have on this podcast cause I played with him in Detroit. So for the Vipers, So it was I mean, I had been traded twice a that point, something crazy happened me and the Kings, and like it was, it was a weird scenario for me where I was like, I don't know why I'm in the minors and why I'm bouncing around and I want to be somewhere else and It was like this kind of really weird scenario when Scottie Nick was on that team and we had, like, probably the worst team ever assembled in the HL. It was Tampa based farm team. They had taken me off waivers and we were horrible. Tampa was horrible and we were horrible and we only one like 20 games that year. Scotty Nichols, Air captain, loved him to pieces like he was 25 or something. 26. I think that year had had played two games with Buffalo at the time. It's in his history. He was 11th round pick or whatever, and he was the power penalty kill guide, A good character guy. But honest, I would never, ever, ever have suggested that he was going to play 600 games NHL. And he left that season with me in Detroit and went on and played 60 games for Calgary the next year. And I still don't know how that happened. Like, I'd love to know how that whole scenario happened for him and and how we got on. But enough about Scotty and I will say that for maybe 30. The guy s so you're working kind of right alongside with him in Nashville, right? Like when you were

spk_0:   1:29:26
there? Yeah. So him and I played together also in ST Louis. Okay, which was where I signed after the lock code. And then I'm get training to Boston from there. But, um, so no, Scotty and I hit it off. He was actually really good buddies in Rochester with money my teammates and Brandon Darren bent on. Okay, So we can add a connection there, and then we really hit it off. And then yeah, and he brought me in to kind of help when he was doing it all by himself doing the player development thing in Nashville. Celts. He was awesome to work with. And I'm sure probably, you know, I don't think has changed much, obviously over the years, because the way you describe him just love them to pieces the way that you know, he operates no guy that he has. He's such a good dude. Um, but no one just to see his. So here's him and I do in the thing. And I was a hype, and he was 1/13 round pick. So it's kind of funny the way we are careers went and the way we could kind of relate with the kids that were coming up through the Predator system, and there's different ways to get there right? So that was kind of the big message we always had was, You know, whether you're high pick whether you're down here and not drafted it all. Whatever, Like it's up to you guys. It's, uh, no. Nothing is written in stone here. It's kind of there's opportunities and and there's a perfect example of a guy that I found a way to do it right. Like Hughes, you know, went to Calgary. He was just a tough vice. He did whatever he had to do. He ended up being like a top faceoff guy, and every every season he played, killed penalties, you know, did all those things that he had to do and did him with energy and was a great guy to have around, probably to which helped him a lot. So

spk_1:   1:31:11
0 100%. I mean, I have a big smile on my face is you're talking about one. Like I said, I love those stories. I do think they're great. Um, like the perseverance in the grit, and I mean to play 56 years in the HL, you know, and and still be there and still really believing and chasing that dream like I'd love to talk about that, whether he actually did believe, you know, if that or if it for if it happened or held, that worked for him. But you touched on a great thing there, which, um, I think we should talk about for a second is. But if, well, being a good teammate, being a good person and like what that actually means as faras longevity and chance and opportunity and all that good stuff like it, it's undervalued oceans. It's undervalued. I think it is valued when it's there, but it's not talked about that much right of Amo mean Moby in an impact. You always talk about the player, right? The player, the player of the player, and that's the focus. That's what you scope. But I think now the discussion is turning more than what type of person this guy is and how this person is gonna help our team. Do you do? Did you see that there with with Nashville? Is that kind of more of the direction now.

spk_0:   1:32:12
Ah, yes, yes. And well, you look at the G M of that has been the same. GM is David toil for the whole, you know, since whatever 98 that they come in the league's over 20 years and just the weight, the person he is and what he values. I mean, that's a big part. They've always been a team That was that was really good and almost exceeded their expectations, I think because they didn't have a lot of money to spend. But they did do their homework and find the right people in good people toe ab there. And if you weren't, you're gonna have that be that person, are you know, if they felt you're a problem or whatever, you know, they do best to help you, but they get people in there that wanted to be there and stuff, and they always found success that way. And now that they kind of taken the step and become one of the elite franchises really in the league, it's they still operate the same way, and they they value that so much. The kind of person, the character that you have a bank. You know, when you want toe, have success and establish a culture that's that's really where you gotta start. And they certainly do that there

spk_1:   1:33:19
and the ah, the development of the prospects is e. I don't think it's at a greater significance to to a franchise than it ever has been now because, you know, with the salary cap air and paying big money for the free agents and and these older guys, right, you need to have your draft fix Turno. You need to have your HL guys come in and feel important roles. So, um, I could really see why people are, you know, taking mean development was I don't always go back to our dinosaur era, But I mean, it wasn't really like that. It was like, You know, we'll find somebody, right? If it's not you, it's somebody else. Now there really is. Ah, feel like there's more of a microscope on your guys because your guys need to become guys that play for you. Um, how do you like what was what was the discussion there And how did you encourage that to happen? Or how do you? And scouted you and Scott handle that development side?

spk_0:   1:34:10
Um, well, no, we you created a relationship with these guys, and you tried And still, you know, the things we've talked about here, like preparation, Physical lake we have. So we bring a man every year, and I think a lot of teams do this, but we have a development camp right after the draft. So you're bringing him in, showing them how to work out, showing him how to eat, you know, mental side of the game, like stuff like that, that maybe they have some experience or knowledge about already. But you're trying to teach these guys, and we're using our experience and what we've gone through and the mistakes we made. Whatever. You know, you're doing your china and still are trying toe pay it forward to these young guys. What? And obviously there's, you know, there's the high prospects, and there's talented guys and stuff that you're gonna focus on a little more, especially when it gets into their season. You're going in. You're trying to watch them a couple of times a year. You do some video stuff with, um but really, what it comes down to is you create a relationship with these guys. You try to get him to feel comfortable. You try to get to know them. Um, you know, if there's things about them that you know what you'd like Teoh like to improve on you. Try to do that. Try toe. Sorry. You're back at your back. Ok, sorry about that, but yeah, you're really trying to just have these guys make him feel comfortable having. I mean, I probably would pump their tires a lot and try to get him feeling good and then to sometimes you gotta be, You know, you got to be honest with them and some kids would come to camp for the development camp and they'd be choppy, they'd be out of shape. And you got to say, like you got this is on you like you got to do the things. This is what you gotta do. If you want to be an NHL player, you gotta put the time and you gotta work. You gotta be conditioned. You know, we talk about body fats and and all these things that thes air things you can control and going back to Scotty and the way that he uh, you know how he made his knish? You came here is always a top condition guy in training. Like he was 1/13 round pick. How are you going to get noticed? What you gonna do to get out there? So you go in your battle hard every day you come to camp in the best shape he possibly can. Um, you know, those air, those air, all intangibles that you can control. So can you control do those things right and give yourself the best chance those air? A lot of the messages we tried to get.

spk_1:   1:36:47
What? What was your touch points during the year? Like to develop that relationship on day two? Really? I guess. I mean, you got to develop trust, right? Because it's one thing to put a figure head in front of somebody and say, you know, here's what you gotta do. Um, and there's nothing that actually developed the trust where they believe you have their best interest at heart. They want to be able to share stuff with you, right? And and then there's there is that relationship. So how does that get built? Is it like once a week is it once a month is it is an open door policy. Or call me when you need me or out. How do you How do you develop that?

spk_0:   1:37:20
Yeah, well, it was Yeah, I guess. Just getting in front of a person. And, you know, you go out for dinner with a master, you go to a game, I guess a lot of it to like, we spent this week at development camp. Weird. There's so myself in Scotty and then to be the coaches from Milwaukee. So you do a lot of things together. You're spending all day together for, like, seven days. If you can get to know some people pretty good, and you just talk to him, right? Like, I don't know. You try to be vulnerable yourself and try toe be open and honest and create a relationship. However, that happens toe develop. But, uh, yeah, you talk to him, and, um, I guess getting in front of them And excuse me, having a conversation, having dinner, just, you know, some some takes longer than others. Um, depended on the people, but, uh, you know each other and that trust and try to tell him like No, this is This is where I see it. This is what I you know I want I want to see you do well. I want you to be the best you could be so tryto try to give them that stuff because I at the end of the day, I didn't really care boats. I didn't get a lot of money to do what I was doing, and obviously I cared about the organization, and the organization is gonna make the best decision they can to be have success. But you're trying to help these young guys to realise what they gotta do and and how they can, you know, get the most out of themselves. So it's

spk_1:   1:38:50
fun to watch.

spk_0:   1:38:50
So, like, because Dante Fabbro was the first when I first got there, I just kind of come on board and he had just gotten drafted. So here's a another protecting V, actually, speaking of both, but, uh, it was really interesting to see where he came from. Um, and there's a few other kids too Young demon Quebec kids that a run. Really, guys that. But you just tried the It's fun to watch because their kids that were committed and wanted it. And you just tried to help him along her path. So it's funny where they developed. Yeah, totally.

spk_1:   1:39:24
Yeah. What if with your time there, what would you Could you pick one or two things that like that you notice with guys coming out of junior Now, whether their top prospects or not, like, the 11 or two things that that is missing, Maybe not in their game, but maybe it is. And, you know, you mentioned preparation a few times. Is there? Is there something that you could say? Hey, guys need help with this. This is this is one thing that they should be focusing on or trying to develop.

spk_0:   1:39:49
Um, I guess at that age, you know, we always gonna have to get stronger and faster. So I think, Yeah, I just, uh you know, what are you doing in the offseason? Conditioning and stuff like that. Um, but other than that, I mean, it is a lot of it comes down toe the player they are and who they are. Um, you know, you try there. No, just tell him like this. You gotta put the work in. You This is the stuff you got to do toe and a lot of them note your are on that right path already, I guess. But, uh, you know, I guess at the end of the date there's a few kid's in the minors right now. Milwaukee A couple young kids from Quebec that a defense, that they're great players. Are they going to be NHL players? I don't know. Like they're right on the edge and there 2122 years old. But you know, they need an opportunity first and and they do everything well, but they don't do anything. No, nothing. Super elite. So you know, you know they're going to get an opportunity that might get there and find in each and and I hope they do. But it's tough. Tough lead to crack.

spk_1:   1:41:05
Turn it. Yeah, I find that interesting. The one thing I work with him with my guys on, uh is developing their own standards, you know? And I think that that's an interesting conversation, because it, you know, you talked about working hard in the in the offseason. And generally teams will give, like, a program, right? Oh, are even like during the season, right, you'll have your practice. That's 20 minutes, and maybe you're supposed to go in the gym and do your 20 minute ride. But there's guys. It'll just do what they're told to do, and maybe they'll do that hard. But they don't They don't think outside that. Like what? What is it that weighed red and does or what is it that Zdeno Char does or Jason Podollan does? That's my own standard, right? That's gonna work for me That's going to separate me, right? And I think a lot of times guys that the younger levels, they get caught up in that right well, I'm doing the work. They think they're doing the work, but it's not really what the work ISS, and they haven't appeared that out for themselves yet, right, what they need to work on to get better. And how do they get need to get better physically? And I think one started. I start thinking about their own standards and what they're willing to do. It's a different conversation, don't you think?

spk_0:   1:42:07
Ah, yeah, I mean, I naturally, some guys just have that de and air. It's ingrained in them to know that maybe they just believe or know that they're going to get there and there's no second guessing, but, um, yeah, I know what it takes it special special recipe, that kind of get there and to know to stay there. Right? So, um, yeah. No, it, uh and I think a lot of it to like you talked about different organizations and situations and opportunities and, you know, some of its luck. I don't know, like you were in the right place at the right time. And you, you know, you get the right coach. I mean, you're on your way, like that's part of it, too. And even this far as winning like, No, there's obviously there's great to the game and Hall of Famers. But you know, if there's guys that have two or three Stanley Cup rings because they happen to be part of that group, you know what I mean? So everything works on a guest for a reason. At the end of the day, you could say, but, um, you try to make the most of their situation you're in and you try toe, Um, I guess just kind of roll is that as you go like you. There's a lot of things out of your control and you just got to kind of work with it. And then there's the things you can control. So try to get the most out every situation.

spk_1:   1:43:30
You know nothing. That's a great point, being ready for your opportunity. Whenever that is, you can control that, and that comes down to preparation, how you're looking at it and you don't know. You don't know how it's going to roll and how many opportunities you're gonna get, who's gonna like you and who's not. And how the fuck is going to bounce your stuff You can't do but the end of the day. I think if you know if you're doing those things away from the rank that are right, it's going to serve you as a guy in this interview is a person is going to serve you as a dad as a husband, as whatever it is you're going to do and you start learning their way the right process, which is something that I've really fallen in love with. You know, I wasn't the time to, but more so after I got out of hockey I mean, how to be a businessman, how to develop a business, how to be a good dad like there's a process to all these things that once you commit to you start making different decisions, and I think that's that's one of the messages that I love. Talking to these young guys about is like It's your decision every day. It's your decision, like who you want to be and who you want to become and what type of player you want to be. And when you kind of start twisted mindset around that a little bit differently, you start making some different choices and and then the other day, you hold your head high. Do you think a man I did? I did what I could, you know, I do what I could. I played. I played the game the right way and and you know, not everyone have 1000 game NHL career, and some guys might not never make it. But, you know, I think again it's getting what is sports teaching us that I think that if that's what it's teaching us, that's a good thing, right? I

spk_0:   1:44:47
know. Yes, I know that's a great perspective, And that's like you said it's going to serve you well, because this game is not gonna last forever. Whatever, kid, you know, where you gonna There's a lot of life to live after. And I think having that right attitude is it's going to serve you well

spk_1:   1:45:04
know, road Reggie, I really appreciate you stepping into your gym and chatting with me. I got to get you to get me into that. That lead you guys got in the winter. I got to come out and play with you guys.

spk_0:   1:45:16
We will get you because we do need a few guys that have a knack to score. Actually, love this old defense minute. Kind of ruled by a lot of the defensive minded while we got a few got Toots is out there. Rene Bork there, the big shooters now, but you could spit it in,

spk_1:   1:45:34
but I'm sure some of the some of the listeners would love to know who is like way never talked about that. But so Wade's living in Cologne and Colonias is a haven for guys who were still playing and guys who have also retired or so there's a lot of there's a lot of names there and they got a They got a game, a regular, a regular weekly game where they come out and play. And let's sell some of the guys who is playing in that.

spk_0:   1:45:56
Well, it's funny, actually, there's so it's ah t NHL players and that. Hockley. We take it pretty seriously here, too. And there's a So the skates been going on for years and, uh, more retired guys coming. There's lots of there's some really awesome dudes that local guys that didn't play pro, too. But Mike Gridley is kind of he's he's retired in the late nineties, but he kind of helps organize things. He's still got that wicked wrister. Um, but Todd Simpson Cory Cross Tyler boats out there. Jordan to 200. A. Bork just came out Quinton laying Uh, who the heck house? A lot of what? A few guys. It that good pro careers went to Europe and stuff, but we had Dean McAmmond out he was dangling around their few years ago, but we'll get you out like I said, a lot of us, rather other toots and Renee. Now they coming out. But there's a few old defense when we play for now, but we don't put it in that.

spk_1:   1:47:01
You what I did read the after I was done because I was done relatively young like 30 31. When I first got done, I end up buying goalie gear. So I was playing many things. A goalie. I always had a little bit of a drought of that. So? So as we're I stepped in. Terrible feeling uncomfortable. Not a place that the home you support doing that. But, uh, yeah, I know. And I'm back. I'm back with my player skates on. I enjoy. Get now. You mentioned Tyler both there. He's actually Ah, he was coaching in my son's leagues. I was coaching the Vernon, the vermin, whatever. Adam team. And he was saying he was West Kelowna. Yeah, the West Kelowna head coach there. So, yeah, I went into him a few times, so it was good stuff. Thanks so much for coming on, Jen. And you know, I know, I know. There's a lot of good things a lot of people can, uh, whatever. Just learn from he said, Perspective and experience, or so, so special. And and there's the young guys doing? And I love that you're given back there with National on DA. Now you're going through with your own kids. Probably in a few different sports, but it's Ah, yeah, Just comes full circle, doesn't it?

spk_0:   1:47:56
Oh, it does. So yeah, it's it's fun. You miss those days, right? Like I I'd go back and love to go do it all again. But, uh, you know, kind of watch these young kids and you got three boys. I got three daughters. So it's fun to kind of see them as they progress. And they love, love the sports air, Getting into stuff now two sorts. It's fun to watch.

spk_1:   1:48:18
I think it's even better. You mean so far. I mean, they're young, but it's so fun, man to be on the other side of help out on the ice and to do that stuff. It really kind of got my my own personal passion for the game back. Really? Right. I was sort of away from it, and I had to be around it and they started loving it. And so now I'm back in it, like, full full on. And it's like Boy, Discreet brings back all those memories, right? And what's so great about the game and what it was such a massive fire of our lives for so long, right? Really. The only thing in our lives for a long time. So it's interesting to see this from a different era and now be ableto, you know, whatever. Hopefully supply some some new perspectives and some experience and some lessons and and just trying to help, right? I mean, it's it's fun helping I enjoy

spk_0:   1:48:55
it. Yeah, yeah, it will be exciting and it's just begun. So it's, uh, hope to see a sea if no one's on the ice. Maybe a fraction higher one

spk_1:   1:49:05
day, right? Man, thanks again. We'll sign off here and, um, really pretty sure your time. Ready?

spk_0:   1:49:13
Yeah, keep in touch. We'll talk to you. Thanks, Clouds.

spk_1:   1:49:16
Well, thanks again for joining us. That conversation with Wade was really special. I think waits personality really came out there. He's such a down to earth guy. He's such an approachable guy. I don't think he's ever forgotten where he's from. His Lloyd minister roots is farming roots, everything that he's gone through. Everything that he went through that he was so vulnerable with even his time down in the minors. That was openly talking about that. A lot of people were very critical of that contract and of him getting sent down. And you know what? This game human right, human human things happen and and sometimes unfortunate things happen to good people. But when you have the right mindset about it, when you take what you do with pride and keep yourself accountable like Wade, did you no good things happen? He came back into the show. He got his 1000 games. He was able to go to the Stanley Cup final. After that, Ah, were a lot of guys. Maybe what Equator maybe would've packed it in. But that was not what weight was all about. And I really appreciate him coming out here today and sharing his story all the highs, some of the lows, and that's what it takes in a career. That's what that's what it's about, that that's that's how you make it. And that's how you make it work. So, ah, once again, wait. I really appreciate you taking the time. All you listeners out there. I really appreciate you taking the time to listen, and, um I look forward to bringing you more, more great guests here and weeks to come stay safe during this Corona thing. I know this is a wild, wild time for a lot of us. We have no idea what's happening. The news changes on the daily. So the best thing that we can do is try and fill our minds and filler souls with good things. And I want to keep this podcast being one of those good things. So for people out there, players out there really take this time to grow. Take this time to get better. Fill your brains with good stuff with good story stuff that you can improve on and stuff that you can use. Uh, getting some good routine's getting some good habits, things that will serve you and, uh, please find opportunities in this because there is some If you want to look for them so once again, stay safe. Everybody stay home, do your part and ah, and try and find the silver lining in all of this. I know it's there for you if you want. If you want to listen eso Thank you so much for listening. And till next time this is Jason. Put on without my hockey