Up My Hockey with Jason Podollan
Up My Hockey with Jason Podollan
EP. 167 - Andy Delmore - Chicago Blackhawks Player Development Caoch - Inside The Mind of A Pro Hockey Developer
We unpack how prospects actually turn pro with Chicago Blackhawks development coach Andy Delmore. Trust, wall play, role clarity, and coachability anchor a candid look at modern NHL demands and how small habits unlock big careers.
• building trust so hard truths land
• identifying two to three core habits per player
• wall play mechanics and pre-scan timing
• using NHL comparables to teach with video
• coachability, processing speed, and failure at pace
• role identity beyond points and PP time
• PK as an entry point to minutes and value
• NHL trends: low to high, shot quality, activation
• pattern recognition and counting numbers
• mindset training and team culture benefits
Get involved: Go to UpmyHockey.com, check UMH68, find your province, and add your name to the watch list
I have to build that relationship and that trust with the player. Uh you know, to uh to get to the point where the the hard conversations uh I don't want to say the word negative um podzi, but just the ones where you tell a kid like you're gonna have to get to the net front at some point in your life. That's where the goals are scored. I know you look good, stick handling with your pep hockey skills underneath stuff and around, and but eventually you're gonna have to get there. Um, and you're gonna have to win those races to the puck. You don't have to let your buddy go do it all the time. Um, that's a beat-around way saying, you know, you gotta give your balls a squeeze. Basically. And those are hard conversations for for kids to accept sometimes.
Speaker 2:That was Andy Delmore, player development coach for the Chicago Blackhawks, and you are listening to the Up My Hockey podcast with Jason Padolin. Welcome to Up My Hockey with Jason Padolin, where we deconstruct the NHL journey, discuss what it takes to make it, and have a few laughs along the way. I'm your host, Jason Pudolin, a 31st overall draft pick who played 41 NHL games, but thought he was destined for a thousand. Learn from my story and those of my guests. This is a hockey podcast about reaching your potential. Hi there, this is Jason Podolin with the At My Hockey Podcast. Welcome back or welcome to the show. Uh, great to have you with us today. We are going to be speaking with a past guest of the podcast, Andy Delmore. Uh, Andy Delmore, in our first interview, which I believe was episode seven, way back in the day, uh, we we chatted about his career for the most part. And it was quite a career at that. Uh, and he and he played lots of games in the NHL with uh with different teams. He also played overseas, he played in the minors, and uh and he was a very, very accomplished defenseman, a very accomplished offensive defenseman that actually put up huge numbers, uh, uh huge goal numbers um during his time there. And he's kind of a it's a very interesting story, if you want to go back and listen to that, uh just how he kind of wasn't able to stick stick as an NHL or even though he was able to score, I think, 18 goals one season. Uh he he he he scored he scored the type of goals or the number of goals that very, very few defensemen score. I believe one year he was he was top three in the league in goals. And um, anyways, you know, it it it it is what it is, and everyone has their story, but uh, but Andy was was a heck of a player. I was able to play with him in in Germany where we became fast friends. We we hung out all the time uh the year that that I played there with him and got to know him really well, and he's gone on to do some great things since he's retired. Uh, he was coaching for a while in the OHL, I believe he was also in the uh in the American League. And now he is working player development for the Chicago Blackhawks. Uh so he gets assigned players from the team, drafted players uh that are trying to become pros and and and future Blackhawks, and and it's his job to help them along uh on their path. So he'll go out to these um you know to these arenas, wherever wherever the players are, and he'll watch them live and he'll meet them, uh meet with them for uh for dinners and he'll speak with them on the phone and and uh watch game tape with them. And uh and yeah, he's just assigned two players to help them become the best player that they can be. Uh he loves what he's doing now. I thought it would be a great opportunity to get him back on the podcast. Uh, as we all know here, this is about player development, so why not talk to somebody who specializes it at the highest level? And um, and we do, we dive into all the good things, uh, player development, uh, and and yeah, it was a great conversation. So uh without further ado, I'll bring you Andy Delmore back for a second time to the Up My Hockey podcast. Enjoy. All right, welcome back to the podcast, Andy Delmore. Happy to have you, partner. Thanks, Podgy. We're uh as I just told you, we're 167 now. And for the real, you know, I don't know what you call it, uh the hardcore Up My Hockey fans would have heard you on episode seven. So this is 160 episodes later, pal. You're back. Good to have you back, and uh, you got a new title now, Chicago Blackhawks Player Development. I think you were coaching in the OHL last time we uh we spoke.
Speaker 1:2020. That was uh pre-COVID, great juring. Pre-COVID. So might have been still in Toledo, possibly. Uh then I made a stop in the OHL uh for a few years, had some great success in Windsor. Uh, but I'm happy to be part of uh you know a great organization in Chicago helping out with their player development.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a ton of fun and a whole whole new bucket of stuff to talk about. So uh yeah, for I don't know what I what I said in the introduction or whatever, but Andy was uh a heck of a player in his own right, I think top two or three for goals in the entire NHL in a season when when he was playing there, I had a chance to play with them in Germany. So extensive background as a player and and now has been given back as a coach and now in player development, and as he said, with Chicago, so super cool. So, how did uh maybe we should just start there? Was it a network type thing as far as getting into the job in Chicago in the first place?
Speaker 1:Yeah, um, I had run into one of my uh old roommates uh when I played in Philadelphia. I ran into him at the draft in uh actually the airport, leaving the draft in Nashville. And uh I had just kind of mentioned to him if there was anything that ever became available, you know, I'd be interested in in that kind of player development side. Um, you know, it's not far off coaching, uh, just from a different lens, basically. But um, and then uh yeah, he had called or I had reached back out to him, you know, maybe six months later, and he said, uh, you know, I think I have a guy that's that's leaving, you know, do you have interest still? And it kind of just went from there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's wild. I think that's cool actually thing to discuss. Like the being a coach, being a head coach, well, if one being a head coach, you you have everything to deal with, right? On the macro, the macro level, and and there isn't a ton of time for individual player stuff, which is generally where the assistant coaches kind of come in, right? They they have more of the hands-on um discussions with the players, they're more interacting with the players, have more of social interactions. Uh, and now you're talking about the player development side, which now it's even less players, and probably I'd assume, than even an assistant coach. Like, how how many guys do you have assigned to you right now?
Speaker 1:Well, I had a few more last year, um, just due to the other person I work with in player development, uh, went to Rockford just with the coaching changes within the Chicago organization. He had kind of helped out in Rockford as the head coach. So I took over some of his players. Um, this year it's uh down to uh seven. Um, I have one kid that's injured right now, he'll be out till uh end of January. So the six, and then actually it was five hockey players for a bit and one football player. I actually uh have the kid Mason West that just won the uh Minnesota State Championship football quarterback, but he's heading to Fargo in the USHL uh next Monday. So then I'll be up to six actual hockey players and then uh one on injured reserve.
Speaker 2:Well, that's wild. So yeah, like the real small nest, essentially, right? Like you got six, seven guys that you can totally focus on, dive into, uh, which you don't have the luxury of doing, like I said, back in the you know, in the traditional coaching job. What do you think is the biggest difference between between the two of them? Being an assistant to be in to be in part of player development.
Speaker 1:Well, I would say travel would be number one. Um, you know, going out to see these guys play, uh, giving them feedback, um, you know, getting to know them as players, as as people, uh, number one. Uh, you know, to make those conversations a lot easier. Um, the hard ones, the good ones, it's it's nice to get to know these kids and see uh, you know, what clicks and you know what uh buttons to push, you know, much like a a coach would do is everybody's got a different personality and a different way of learning and communicating. So uh just trying to get to know them on that side of it and then go from there, Bodzi.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no doubt. So look maybe that's I find that really interesting. The the hockey player slash football player. So he is somebody that was drafted by you guys, but he's just a multi-sport athlete at a at a high level, obviously.
Speaker 1:Yeah, last year, uh first round pick um out of uh Minnesota high school uh hockey, a Dyna. Um, but he was a two-sport athlete basically all the way growing up. Uh and he had been playing football with this with his high school class, you know, even pre-high school. So he had kind of mentioned that he'd like to finish the senior year in in high school football. And uh I actually had the chance to go out and see him twice play football uh this year. Uh the last time being in the state semifinals, which was a couple weeks ago, uh threw for four TDs and ran for one. Uh and the other thing, Podzi, which is you're gonna be go, oh my goodness, is he's 6'6, 6'5, 230. Uh right-handed shot, forward. So um, you know, and believe me, when I when I see him on the football field, he runs and uh, you know, you think 6'6, you think the big duck, clumsy feet, and he just can't get around. He gets around really well. And uh, you know, a quarterback leading his team, you know, getting the plays from the sidelines, you know, there's lots of things uh to be excited about with this young kid.
Speaker 2:That's wild. And so I know you're not involved in the drafting part of it, but I'm sure there must have been a lot of discussion about, you know, is he going to play hockey? Like, is he choosing hockey over football? Is is that a decision that seems to have been made at this point for him?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm pretty sure we would have never drafted him in the first round if he would have said, Well, I'm gonna think about going, you know, either way, maybe he didn't know, but I'm I'm uh, you know, he committed to hockey, he's committed to Michigan State next year uh on a hockey scholarship. So uh as far as I know, Posse, that was his last football game last week.
Speaker 2:Right, right. Wow. Um, because I mean sounds like there was that there would have been there would have been a lot of offers, uh it sounds like on the football side, I'm sure on the university level too, uh, for for how big he is and and the type of player that you're saying.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I I I'm not a football scout, I don't know how good he is in comparison to uh you know some kid in Texas or you know California, but uh I don't know Minnesota football that well, all right.
Speaker 2:You know what four TDs is, and you know what a running and uh and a running touchdown is. That's that's fun.
Speaker 1:It's better than it's better than what we would be doing, that's for sure.
Speaker 2:Yeah, for sure. That's fun. So you got seven players in the mix. You you talked about learning, you know, how to push their buttons. Uh I I guess that is like when you're assigned a player, you I would I would assume that the kind of the general uh objective is to get them to be as good as they can be. Um, you know, and if that happens, then they have the best chance to to become an NHL or and a and a Chicago Blackhawk. Is there any mandate around that? Um, about how that happens or what you what you do to help them become their best?
Speaker 1:Well, I I think you know, the first thing we do is, you know, not just myself, but you know, my my boss and uh, you know, who's also the assistant general manager with the Blackhawks and who's in constant communication with our head GM Kyle Davidson, assistant GM Normac Kyver, our advisor Brian Campbell. Uh, you know, we try and identify what uh what are the things that um so and so needs you know to make it to the NHL. Um you know, as a staff, we kind of put that together and then I can kind of go through that in more detail. Uh you know, let's just say uh I'm gonna use a kid, uh I won't won't say his name. Well, I can say his name, Nick Lardis, you know, scored 72 goals, 72 goals, 71 goals, sorry, in the OHL last year. You know, what does he need to do in Rockford uh this year to get better? Uh you know, is it wall play? It could be something so minuscule that's keeping him out of the NHL. Um so I had him last year and now he's in Rockford. He's got a whole staff there on the development side, you know, but just it can be something so small, and then finding those habits uh and helping him with those habits to get better at the wall play uh in all three zones. It doesn't have to be defensive zone, getting the puck out, could be neutral zone, you know, board play behind the net, uh, all those types of things that that go into wall play. So it could be something as small as that for one player.
Speaker 2:Yeah, awesome. Uh, how about for those listening? Like, so you in that scenario, like let's say so you work with this player, player X. It is wall play that is the thing that they're working on. Uh, you're watching, like, you travel to watch this guy. Um, as far as I know, maybe you are, maybe you're on the ice actually doing skill development work with them, but like, how does that how does that now translate something like wall play to this player when it comes through your relationship with him?
Speaker 1:Uh yeah, I've been on the ice. I don't go on the ice that often. Um I think all these kids in all these leagues these days have enough coaches on ice and skill development guys on ice. But I have gone on. Um, just creating the habits. Um, you know, not too many. Let's just say there's three habits to work on on wall play. You could go through uh, you know, pre-scanning, um, you know, proactive contact, um, you know, driving the D-Man back and then coming back for the puck. You know, all these habits and things that we can work on. And then obviously I have a pretty extensive um video library on my computer where I can go through it with these players. Um another thing, Podsia, I'd like to ask these guys is, you know, who do they model their game after? Who is someone in the NHL that uh, you know, they want to compare themselves to? Obviously, as coaches and develop, you know, like yourself, coaches and development staff, we always you know find a comparison for this kid. Uh let's say this kid is a big um I don't name me a winger in the NHL podzi, quick. Give me somebody.
Speaker 2:Wilson. Tom Wilson.
Speaker 1:Okay, so now we'll bring up Tom Wilson's clips and I'll go find some wall play uh from Tom Wilson and show this kid that thinks his comparison is Tom Wilson. And we'll look at what he does, uh, you know, just to see it. And then obviously I can go through his clips later on and go through his wall play. Uh we can dissect it, you know. Uh very simple, like, you know, what were you I didn't see you pre-scan here. You know, what could you what could you have done better on this play? And we can just go through it uh on a video session, excuse me. And then uh obviously when I go see him play, I'll watch the wall play. And it's not just that, there's other you know, things in the game what that we're watching as well. Uh you know, it could be his just his overall effort or um, you know, any other little things as well, Podzi. Uh let's say this kid's on the power play and he didn't have a good night. Uh maybe because he flipped sides, he went from a strong side to a one-timer side on the pee pee that night. We can talk about it after the game. Maybe some pointers there on you know, some positioning, some timing things. So it's not just stuck on a couple things. There's always stuff to add and stuff to improve on.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah, but I like that even that that approach, to be honest, because when when it becomes lots of things, you know how that goes. Sometimes it's hard for the player to even really digest which one, right? Especially if we're trying to change some habits. So um there is a lot of things in the game, and I'm sure you know someone of your of your experience will be able to spot them, but uh keeping the kid on the rails and you know what is the core things that we're trying to do here because that doesn't happen overnight. Um I'm gonna actually give you the example. I I got a player here uh that we're working with in in Queer d'Alene, and uh anyway, he's really good player, but I think he has a hard time getting into the middle, right? Like likes to move pucks and kind of stay on the outside, uh, but you know, has has the ability to get there big, strong, you know, fast, just but is the habits that he's created over the course of his time is you know it has him on the outside. Uh so my question is.
Speaker 1:We have those guys, we have those guys too, Podzi.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. I believe it, right? And and how important is that, right? To add to add another layer to their game and score goals from the inside and not just the outside and depending on the shot and this, that, and the other. So trying to work with him on that. And and and so in those discussions, like I'm talking about the habits and saying, hey man, like these things are hard to break. Like, just because we have this conversation right now that I ask you to do this, I understand that it's probably not just going to happen, uh, you know, the next game or whatever. But I'm like, where you need to buy into the idea is that you need to have reps and you need to think about this without being on the ice. Because if you just wait for it to be on the ice, I'm like, like, that is going to be a really long process, and you're probably gonna get stuck, you know, a few times. So, like for me, the visualization aspect is like how you can speed this up and like and how guys can really buy in. Uh, do you guys do you talk about that much with with with your players as far as that side? You know, I mean, like I'm thinking the wall play too, because that would be such a you know, if you're not pre-scanning and if you're not, you know, making creating space for yourself, right? Like, this is something that yes, you need to work on in practice for sure, but I would think that you need to see yourself in those situations, like visually see yourself uh doing it right, uh, so it becomes more of a habit on the ice. But you know, how do you guys handle that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think uh obviously showing the video of um some other players doing it correctly um can help you visualize. Oh, that's what it looks like. Um, I I I did see him pre-scan. That's that uh that's where he did it. That he got to that point in the ice and he goes, Oh the D's coming around the net. Now maybe I should scan before I get this puck and maybe get run over. Uh you know, so I think seeing it done correctly. Um, you know, it doesn't always have to be your comparison or whatever, but that that's gonna help you visualize and see how it's done correctly. Um hopefully it's one of the Chicago Blackhawks that I'm showing. It it just it makes it a little bit uh better uh to see our guys doing the things correctly and uh you know go from there.
Speaker 2:Yeah. The uh when it comes to the idea of coachability, like so you know, you are helping these guys get better, and so one of the things that I was kind of talking about is like the ability to buy in, right? It's one thing to say you want to be a player, right? And you do want to improve, but like there is I've seen it, that there's there's ways to be coachable, right? The way like the quicker guys can apply. I'm sure you've seen it now, like we're working with how many players that you've worked with. Like, some guys are able to implement quicker, some guys are able to adapt quicker. Uh, what do you see in the players that are able to do that? Like, what are some of the intangibles that you you can speak to that that allows the player to develop maybe quicker than somebody else?
Speaker 1:It's kind of the magic question sometimes, Podzi, is uh you know, everybody learns differently, everybody adapts differently. I think sometimes you can just see it when you're talking to somebody the eye contact they're making. Uh some of the young kids, you know, you're talking to them and they're looking up in the stands. Oh, there's a nice advertisement. But you know, other kids that they stare at you and you know they're adapting and they're not afraid to try things, I guess I would say. And they're not afraid to try it at a high speed. Um you know, failure is okay at at the early stages of doing things. And if you're doing it with speed and pace, uh I think it's gonna you're gonna adapt a little bit quicker. Although there might be a few more mistakes in the beginning. Uh believe me, all coaches know that's gonna happen. Uh that that's part of the learning curve in the process. But uh, you know, making mistakes is not a big deal. I I think you gotta push yourself, push the limits and do it quickly.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, 100%. You you mentioned uh you mentioned listening there. I actually just saw a clip on coaching saying that uh, you know, if you want to be an elite hockey player, you have to be uh an elite listener. Uh that engagement, like I find that engagement from from kids who aren't, you know, making eye contact just to make eye contact or like thinking about what they're supposed to say, but actually trying to process, you know, and being involved in the conversation and being engaged in the conversation. Uh, do you feel that that is uh that is a development skill, the ability to listen?
Speaker 1:Elite listeners are usually uh like you said, they they get it quicker. Um and it's actually pretty hard to sometimes to establish who is an elite listener because there's a lot of kids that will be looking at you and saying and doing all the right things, and then they go on the ice and you just don't see it. So elite listeners and there's elite processors. Uh you know, you got to process the information and then and then go be able to do it as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the the idea of coachability, I talked out about that with my with my group and just telling them like how important that is, you know. One to understand the concept, which is great, like you have to be able to listen at the first place, right? You know, like you said, like sometimes you have guys that are here or whatever, or you're giving them feedback, and you can tell there's resistance for whatever reason they're not listening, really, right? So they don't even really have the concept. So there's like there's that aspect. Phase one is like what is being asked of me, and do I understand it? And then the next part is like the implementation, like, can I now apply this? Yep, can I process it and go apply? Yeah, can I process and go apply? Like, am I am I able to follow through on that scenario? And I I told my guys, I mean, we got 15, 16-year-old here right now at the UAT level, and um 17-year-olds too. And I'm like, like, you have no idea how valuable like this concept is for you guys, right? Because you know, someone like you, even and you're assigned, you know, some high-profile Blackhawks, like it can give you a trying if a guy isn't able to apply or feels like he's not listening. You know, I'm like, a coach only has so much bandwidth for for being able to be repetitive. Like, I know it's our job to do it, but I was like, guys, like, you know, if I get resistance like the 10th time I'm trying to talk to you about something, like at some point, I'm just gonna give, you know, I'm I'm going talking to another guy at some point, you know. You only get you only get so many chances, right? And that's the last thing you want, right? Like, that's the last thing I want. That's the last thing you want, you know. Like, you you want to have opportunity, you want to get better. So I said, I don't know where you guys like, you have to be able to self-audit in the process too. Like, can you get past phase one, which is the listening? Like, do you get the concept? Or are you having a problem with phase two, which was the application? And once you understand that, now maybe I can help you with that with that scenario. Um, I assume guys get in their own way. I know they do because I've been that age before, and I'm sure I got in my own way at times. You know, how how do the discussions go? Like, how honest are you with saying, like, hey man, like this is this is an area like we got to work on, like it might be not a hockey area. This is you know, this is something that we gotta talk about and and get out of your own way. Are the are those the discussions you're talking about?
Speaker 1:It takes time. I guess it takes time. You I I have to build that relationship and that trust with the player, uh, you know, to to get to the point where the the hard conversations, uh I don't want to say the word negative, um podzi, but just the ones where you tell a kid like you're gonna have to get to the net front at some point in your life. That's where the goals are scored. I know you look good, stick handling with your pap hockey skills underneath stuff and around, and but eventually you're gonna have to get there. Um, and you're gonna have to win those races to the puck. You don't have to let your buddy go do it all the time. Um that's a beat-around way saying, you know, you gotta give your balls a squeeze. Basically. And those are hard conversations for for kids to accept sometimes.
Speaker 2:Right. Yeah, 100%. And I and I'm sure there is kids where you, if you say it that way, you know, further personality, they that's the most receptive they can probably be to it. And then there is some other guys where you probably have to say like what you said the second time. Give your balls a squeeze. Like, you got to be more courageous or you gotta be tougher, you know, you got to get to the front of the net. And that might be the the sledgehammer that actually wakes a guy up and makes him understand what's going on. I like them. There's nuance, man, in language for sure. And it does matter how you talk to people, like different players process stuff different ways. And um, and yeah, the the message, the message totally matters. Take a short break from the conversation to tell you it is umh68 time. That is the Up My Hockey 68, the invitational event that is running throughout Western Canada this 2026. We have released the watch lists on the UpmyHockey.com website. So you should get over to UpmyHockey.com, go to the W uh the Umh68 portion, and see what's available in your province. We are unleashing uh a female event in BC, in Saskatchewan, and in Manitoba this year, uh different age groups on that. So get it get um get your eyes on on where we're coming, uh, who we are uh catering to, and get your names on the watch list. Uh another uh another opportunity with UMH 68 is for people who want to be involved in it from a sponsorship category. Had some amazing sponsors last year, Biosteel, uh, Elite Prospects. Uh we had uh we had lots of involvement from local companies, and uh and it was just uh it was a fantastic, fantastic 2025 season. Uh but as always, we're looking to grow. Uh, one of the things that I take pride in with the UMH 68 is keeping the costs low for what for what the players get at our events. Uh the value is uh is so recognizable when you compare it to other showcases, other events that go on. And for for me, I don't want to raise the prices to match the value. I would actually like to lower the prices so it makes it makes it attainable for every player that has earned an invite to get there. And we can only do that uh with the sponsorship dollars and with the people that want to get involved and donate to the scholarship fund. So if you are somebody that's an individual that wants to support young hockey players to come to a great development showcase event, uh then by all means, uh please reach out. Uh if you are a company owner, whether it be a local company or a provincial company or a national company that would like to get behind female uh and male youth hockey, uh, that really supports the development of the person behind the hockey player. One of the things that my hockey prides itself in, then by all means, please reach out. Uh, we'd love to get you involved and we'd love to make this be the place uh for development in uh in Western Canada. So uh thanks for tuning in. Uh Um H68 again. The watch lists are out. Check it out. Now let's get back to the conversation. What's your favorite part about what you're doing right now?
Speaker 1:Uh I think I've said this numerous times. It's helping kids achieve their goals. Um me and you were lucky enough, or I know in my head, and I think you I'm not gonna put words in your mouth, but just playing one game in the NHL um is all I wanted to do as a kid. It wasn't about scoring you know, the game seven hat trick on the road hockey game. It was just I wanted to play one game. And I just want to help these kids achieve whatever their goals are. If their goal is to play a thousand games in the NHL, they told me that. I would do everything I can to help that happen. Um and the great news when you're drafted by the Chicago Blackhawks, our scouting department does a great job of uh um finding great kids that want it. So that eliminates a lot of that for me. Um I would say 99% of the kids I work with are all in and they want it, which makes my job a lot easier. Yeah, 100%.
Speaker 2:The uh how how does that work as far as the transfers? So you say you you you get a player um you know out of the draft, let's say, I I assume, and then you said like the one player now went to Rockford. So so you worked with him last year, now he's in Rockford. Is he still your player at Rockford, or is that going hand it over to somebody else there?
Speaker 1:Well, it's kind of uh yeah, we we all have our hands still in it, I guess. Like I was in actually Austin, Texas last weekend, uh seeing Rockford play against the Texas Stars. And it was more because I have a relationship with some of those kids. We have some skill development guys in Rockford and whatnot. Obviously, a coaching staff there that I know as well. And you know, it it's just like a guy, uh I'll say like Gavin Hayes, who's uh you know, a gifted goal scorer that hasn't scored. Yet this year. He's 20 games in. Um, and sometimes a different voice to Gavin helps. You know, so after a game, actually game two, you know, he had about three grade A chances. He fanned on a one timer and he missed the net twice in the slot. You know, for a guy that hasn't scored, you know, you should probably hit the net. You know, make that scope a little bit smaller. If you're shooting at a spot like this big, you know, expand that a little bit. Let's let's just try and help. And uh, you know, Gavin isn't essentially one of my players, but we all have our hands trying to help Gavin get better, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. So it's a collective effort. Um the uh and the same thing, I guess. I mean, you work with a player that ends up going to the to the Blackhawks, like really, I mean it's a shaking of the hand, like you're celebrating that he got to where he got to. Technically, I guess he's not your player anymore. Now he's a Blackhawk, but I'm sure you've established some relationships there that you know, like you stay in touch and and and I assume would give whatever support that player is still looking for, even though they are in the NHL.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I I always say to anybody that's even in the AHL or NHL, you have my number. Uh, if you ever need anything, need any help with anything, you know, just give me a call. Um, obviously, Jeff Blasch and his staff do an amazing job, you know, but it it could be something off the ice as well. It you know, it doesn't have to be on ice, and he just needs somebody to talk to. I tell them, you know, there's never a time that I'm not gonna answer the phone. So yeah.
Speaker 2:With with um with regards to the game, like the NHL game, uh, there is obvious differences between you know guys in the AHL or even junior, you know. So they're progressing through the levels and they're progressing through like the way the game is played. You you mentioned the wall play aspect, and I know it was just sort of a off the cuff kind of thing to pick at, but like you watch an NHL game now, like it is all along the wall. Like, it is all along the wall. Offensive zone way more than ever before, too. I find like with the puck protection and uh end zone. And uh, is there any other trends that you're kind of seeing where yeah, like this this skill uh you know is essentially essential to to to the advancement?
Speaker 1:Well, I guess I'll ask you why do you think the wall plays important now? What happens in the middle of the ice?
Speaker 2:Well, there's not enough, there's not as much room there.
Speaker 1:You know, that's where a lot of turnovers happen, yeah. Uh in the middle of the ice. And when you turn a puck over in the middle of the ice, which I was really good at, as you know, um bad things happen. So uh the new trend for me, which uh I can see happening, is obviously these D-manning D-men getting pucks to the net offensively. Um, you know, like you said, the wall player, the Fords do a great job down low, they're cycling it, you know, they're rolling um you know, defensive uh schemes are you know, they're they're uh they're just so tight down low. They're taking away you know the net front, they're taking away the low plays, uh, which seems to be leaving the points you know more readily available, is those kids getting pucks to the paint, uh to the net front with uh your forwards getting there. Um I just think the more I watch, the more I see when when you get you know pucks and people to the net, good things are happening. Uh people lose coverage, people's backs turned, rebounds. There's a lot of good things going on. So I know that's a little old school, maybe, but I think it's kind of coming back a little bit.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, the low to high for sure. Like I just like the the the amount of reverses in the offensive zone, let's call them, right? Like a rim, like an offensive rim. Like I I think back in our day, like we would rim it to get in, but very rarely do I ever remember rimming from like the weak side or strong side all the way to the weak side to the point of the top, right? Like we like that play has become really standardized now, you know, to to spread teams out and then to get the puck back to the point. Um, and and yeah, to your to your uh to your point there, like the the wisters from the point getting through is something that is totally happening. And the thing I also noticed though is like the amount of not wasted shots from the forwards just coming down and throwing a puck on net, like you know, the they're much more strategic and picky about how they get pucks to the net. You know, like you see an NHL game now, there's very rarely over 30 shots on goal, oftentimes, even you know, at the end of you know, two periods I've been noticing 12 shots, 15 shots. Shot quality, yeah. Shot quality, right? Like waiting for traffic, waiting for net front. The goalies are too good without a screen with nobody coming, they can control rebounds and suck it up. So I just noticed that there's no there's no wasters anymore, right? Which means puck possession is much more of a priority.
Speaker 1:No, no, I kind of wish they would waste a few once in a while. Yeah, you know, some of these goalies haven't seen a shot in eight minutes, and you're gonna come down. And you know, maybe it's not a great A, but you know, maybe if you're just just outside the dots, you might test them. Yeah, you know, because like you said, they're not getting a lot of quality shots. Um, and I'm still to the fact that the goalies aren't that good. I guess that's just my mindset, yeah, as a shooter. If I believe he's that good, I'm gonna it's not I I still think they're not very good.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know. Good point, good point. You mean giving a guy too much respect, you know, can can yeah. I mean, that that can have its uh you know, that can hurt because people are willing or able to make mistakes. We all see that, you know, uh a hundred percent.
Speaker 1:They still go through their arms once in a while. It happens.
Speaker 2:Lots of times, yeah. It's wild. I watched that Edmonton Dallas game last night.
Speaker 1:How did that look?
Speaker 2:Well, Skinner got pulled on eight shots, four went in. Um, you know, Picard wasn't too much better. And yeah, they're they're in a they're in a world of hurt right now, those guys. But uh have you ever been have you ever had a goalie?
Speaker 1:No, we have we actually have a development goalie guy.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I leave them alone.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that would be a whole different world, yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1:I think Edison might be looking for a new guy, too, apparently.
Speaker 2:Oh, there you go. Well, what about uh what about the D? I mean, you as a D man, you're talking about offensive zone. You know, there there wasn't as much activation when we were playing. It seems like everyone, well, maybe not everyone, but that there's much more uh runway for guys to get off the line and to move and and to come through. Uh, any any skills or any essential things that you see in today's defensemen um that are kind of requirements?
Speaker 1:Um I think they have just this ability to read the play differently, and that activation is happening at such a young age. Um, you know, just the wall play, like old school, like the scissors podsy and getting to the middle of the ice. And the other thing I'll say with a lot of these D-men, uh, you know, systematically, these F3s are so much more they're doing a great job covering for them. If there is a mistake, you know, they have people behind them. Back in the day, if I made a mistake, it was the guy got a breakaway. Yeah, you know, my partner was sleeping on the other side of the ice in the F3, who knows where he was, and it was basically a breakaway. Now, these D men there's they're insulated so well with with the team play that it's allowing them to take some more chances up top, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. The uh the idea of being an offensive D-man. Well, you know what? Maybe I'll ask you that because there's so many parents, and I'm talking now at the amateur level and the lower level, like that have physically said to me, Well, you have to have points now, you know, to to advance. And I'm like, what do you mean you have to have points? Like, no, you like I'm like, I think that's completely wrong. Like that there are sure there's a desire, right, to have players like a Quinn Hughes that can go and walk the blue line and do whatever they're doing, but there's still players that you need to be really great at defending and getting the puck out, for instance. You know, like there's absolutely yeah, so like when when you when you're working with D now at the pro level, like I would assume not everybody was the quarterback uh of the power play, like when they get drafted. Like, how how do you see that as far as like a player identity um aspect with with who comes through and and what teams are looking for?
Speaker 1:Well, I think there's a good thing in saying even though you're drafted, you sometimes you still don't know what your identity is. Um you know, I've had guys in junior that have had over a hundred points and I'm telling them okay, can we please let's work on penalty killing? Like that might be how you're gonna make the NHL or face-offs. Although you had a hundred in junior, you know, let's look over Chicago's lineup and and have a look, and he'll be like, oh, I might not even be able to make that third line. So there's other ways where these kids are gonna have to, you know. To me, if you're a good power play guy, you should be able to penalty kill. It's a skill, you know. Are you do you have the willingness to block shots? Obviously, face-offs, good sticks, speed, lateral movement. There's lots of ways to become a good penalty killer, and it's something that I think every kid can adapt to and and work on. Yeah, you know, these skills, other skills that they're not that they haven't been doing, you know, for a while. Yeah, something to work on.
Speaker 2:Yeah, or ever, right?
Speaker 1:And uh and Ponzi, you know one of my players there, Jack Prittham, who is out in West Kelowna, who's in Kitchener, uh, you know, who is a real offensive threat and um, you know, a great skater. And he's an overager in junior this year. And like we talk about penalty killing all the time now because his speed is so elite on that penalty kill, he's gonna get offense from that, and it's gonna allow him to close passing lanes, uh, you know, good long stick. He's got long arms, he can take up a lot of space. So we've been working on that this year.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and like you said, that could be an entry point into uh more minutes at the at the pro level, right?
Speaker 1:Uh more minutes to help your to help your team win, which makes everything good.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah, that is the thing. And and I guess that that might be the like that could be uh a blocker for some guys. Uh the idea of hey, I think I'm a goal scorer and I've always been on the power play. Uh now I'm a third line guy and I really need to, you know, commit to the PK or commit to, you know, not just not getting scored against. And I don't really like that, you know, I don't really have fun with that. Uh yet that needs to be, you know, their entry point. Uh, do you do you see any resistance when it comes to that? Or or how does that even get like I guess communicated um in a way that they they get it? Because maybe they don't want it or maybe they don't believe it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's that's that's my job is to make them believe it. Right. Um, you know, you we talked about that two weeks ago, buddy, that you know, you want to play in the NHL. And this is a way that you can make it. Right. You know, I'm sure you have, you know, you said 15, 16, 17 year olds, they all think they're flankers on the PP. Well, do you does anybody want to stay in that front and get 20 and make the NHL? Right. You know, there's there's different ways to skin the cat around there. And you know, I think identifying different roles and you know, uh identifying that if you do these things, you're gonna be a better hockey player.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, that is wild. I mean I I find it interesting because I mean somebody does have to play the flank on the PP, right? Like there is somebody at the NHL that does that. I mean, generally speaking, most teams will have like somebody that's a certified superstar doing that. Um, but they were something somewhere else, right? I mean, like you talked about the hundred-point guy that you have, or the guy that scored 70, right? Like, not everybody can score 70 in in junior, like that's a very rare accomplishment. Uh, you would think that's like this guy could be should be a 30, 40 goal scorer in the NHL. Uh, and some of them do become that, and some of them don't, right? Like, that's like the million-dollar question to me. It's like how some guys do become that at the top level in the world, and how some guys, for whatever reason, like that skill, something maybe that that is holding them back, just doesn't allow it to transfer. And um, and I guess that's where guys like you come in.
Speaker 1:And sometimes it's not even the fact that they're not good at being a flanker. There's four other guys that are better. Yeah, that's all. So, do you want to get in the bumper spot? Uh, you know, do you want to get net front? And you know, you're still gonna be able to show your skill with some slip-off plays to the side of the net, but uh, you know, it doesn't mean you're a bad player if you're in the bumper on a power play. Yeah, you know what I mean? That it's still a good thing, yeah.
Speaker 2:It's a good thing. Yeah, did you um uh Frankie Nazer? I I didn't really follow him really much at all. Uh I I my eyes first got on him when he actually signed that contract. And to be quite frank, I didn't even know that he was an NHLer. Uh, right. I'm not I'm not that involved with everything. And uh and I was like, holy crap! And then I looked at his stats and I was like, wow, like again, without seeing a shift of his, you know, I think he scored maybe 20 or something at the NHL level, and he gets this huge deal. And and I'm like, well, they must know something that, you know, whatever. I don't know, right? Or what the stats don't know. And and he looked, and then I got the opportunity to see them. We saw Chicago in Minnesota in in exhibition, and he ended up, I think he had two that game. And boy, like looked polished, like looked way beyond his years, you know. And I was like, Oh, well, I mean, I kind of get it now, right? Like, this guy looks looks to be pretty good. Player development, buddy. Well, there you go, and that's why I want to connect that is because why why this guy, right? There is guys that score 20, you know, uh in the same amount of time. Sometimes that doesn't transfer. Like, what why what did you guys see in him and and how did how did his uh development like progress to a fact of like we're committing to this guy long term, like we really believe in what what he's all about?
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, the first time I got to see Frank play was when he just came out of the University of Michigan. Um, and he was, I'm trying to think, he then he went down to Rockford, uh, didn't make the team out of camp that year. Uh went down to Rockford uh for I believe six weeks, podsy, maybe two months, I'm not 100% sure. Uh got off to a kind of a slow start the first couple weeks in Rockford, then all of a sudden just something clicked in his head. Um and he just started going, going, going, got called up, and just that was it. He's like, as soon as he got called up, there was something internally inside him that said, I never want to go back to the AHL. And his play, his energy, his uh it just took off. And uh there's something inside of Frank that motivates him that is special. And uh he I think he goes on the ice every night. And I'm not saying he has a chip on his shoulder, that's not the right word. Uh you know, an underside speedster, but he's just got this grit that uh I guess we didn't really see or I didn't see before. And uh, you know, he's a he's a gamer. He's that the he fits the word gamer.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, and he uh he's got skill. I mean, there's some there's definitely polish there, his release. The one goal that I saw in Minnesota was like holy crap, like real elite shot.
Speaker 1:Uh kind of tricky speed, like he doesn't you know, he doesn't look like a burner, but all of a sudden he's by you, yeah, and you're not catching him.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, which is fun for your organization to see, you know, obviously cool for him to commit to. Uh, but yeah, the deals that these guys are getting, hey, like after you know Logan Cooley, Dylan Gunther, you know, Frankie Nazar.
Speaker 1:I know there's other guys too that aren't slipping by mind, but like how much of the cap going up do you think that is um, you know, giving those deals earlier, knowing that the cap's gonna grow, get them get them early instead of getting them later, type of theory. And when I talk about this, this is completely out of my realm of player development. This is um, you know, this is GM, assistant GM kind of talk. This is uh us just on the outside, you know, kind of looking in.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, of course. Yeah, just yeah, just spitballing. But yeah, I mean that it's a big commitment for sure, right? Like the idea, the idea that you are gonna be willing to throw, you know, tens of millions of dollars at a guy that uh technically isn't proven, right? I mean, the whole idea was like the the GMs in our day would hold on to that, you know, that group two kind of scenario and and will use that second contract for as long as you could, right? Because all they have to do is qualify you to maintain your rights. I think that you know the the guys are more willing, I think, to take that offer sheet scenario off the table. That's the other thing I think, like with what St. Louis did there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that kind of changed things a little bit, eh?
Speaker 2:I think it did, you know, like guys are guys aren't as willing to let that happen, you know. Like if you if you if you think that you want them around and you know you're not gonna use that because the leverage is gone a little bit with with knowing that uh guys might might take a stab at them. So yeah, anyways, but good to see. We are doing that currently with the Thunder Bay Kings up in Ontario. All of their triple A programs are running through the Peak Potential Mindset Project and having coaching calls with me. It's been a fantastic experience so far for the group and for myself, and it really is a competitive advantage uh for the players that get to participate in it. Uh, not only do the individual players learn how to become the best player that they can be to be able to manage their emotions, be able to control their development and their uh and their and their performance on the ice, but the group as a whole now has a whole different level of resiliency, a whole different level of uh language that they can use uh to perform together throughout the year. So if you're looking for team building 101, if you are somebody that believes in building uh the toolkit around the player uh to allow them to be the best hockey player that they can be. Uh and if you aren't doing something when it comes to mental training, mental fitness, uh whatever you may call it, then Up My Hockey may be where you need to look. Uh I do believe that the way that we offer the program, uh the curriculum involved, the way the players take the program, uh it really trumps anything that is out there, to my knowledge. Uh the workshop format is dead, in my opinion. Uh for me to get in front of somebody for an hour, a team, and try to communicate the skills of grit or resilience or of mental agility uh is much too long. And to be able to teach in that environment uh it just isn't absorbed enough, and then things don't get applied. Uh the way that we have done it here at Up My Hockey is short form video approach curriculum that the players consume on their own time. They do the assignments and their and their uh their homework on their own time, and then we come together for a group call where the players engage uh with me and each other about what they're learning, how they're applying it, and what they're using. So there is very little lecturing time involved. This is all about application, it's all about using information and then applying the information and executing the information so they actually become better players. And the results speak for themselves. Uh it it's it's been so fun to help the growth of uh of the individual players and also as the teams. So if you are in a decision-making process and if you want something that's been proven, that is effective, that not only checks the box of yes, we are doing something for these players when it comes to mindset, but it actually makes a difference for the players that is more than just a checkbox. It is something that builds culture, it builds leadership, it builds community, and it builds performance. Uh then come over this way. Up My Hockey will take care of you. Uh, that is the overall business plan, too, of Up My Hockey, just to be frank, is like we need to service teams, uh, we need to service associations so we can grow good human beings within the jurisdictions where they are. So when a player walks into your spot as a U13 or U11 competitive player, they will continue to graduate with Up My Hockey curriculum as long as they stick with the program. Uh it takes a lot off the plate from the coaches, it takes a lot off the plate from the administrators. Uh, you'd be surprised how much fewer problems there are in general when it comes to a team format because players are more easy or more readily available to deal with adversity and look at it as an opportunity uh that some of the uh you know the headaches and things go away as well. So it really does conquer uh solve a lot of a lot of problems, uh provides a lot of solutions. So again, we are open. We love to have conversations. If you are curious at all, uh look us up, jason at upmyhockey.com or send in a contact form on the website. Uh we're already a quarter of the way, halfway through this year. Uh sometimes these decisions get made a year in advance. So if you want to start the conversation now, uh bring it on. We're willing to have it. Now let's get back to the conversation. You know what I'm gonna ask you? I I had on um, so I'm here in in CDA, and the head of hockey is Jeremy Milmock, and uh his son, Connor, is in Rockford. And uh anyways, I had a chance to meet Connor uh over the summer, really like him, like saw his work ethic, and he skated with us a little bit and and started to know a little bit more about him. And this guy seems uh old school in all the right ways. Uh just wondering with you having eyes down there, like how do you what do you what do you see with Connor and and uh and you know his chances of making his dream come true of going going with the NHL?
Speaker 1:Um, you know, arguably I saw two games last weekend in Dallas, and I he I would say he was our most consistent forward for two games. Uh obviously, um Nick Lardis had four goals in two games against Texas. Like, yeah, you need those goal scorers, but this is one tough cookie. Like, I mean legit tough. Like and he's like one of our players, Kevin Korczynski, got uh got speared, uh five-minute major, uh, for actually from a kid out west their last name, Lind. Uh, I can't remember his first name now. Anyways, that was game one, game two back to back. Right after him. Like, not even a question. And uh finishes checks not just to hit, but to put put him in the second row. Like uh between him and another guy, we have Dylan Boucher, who actually uh is from the ECHL as well. Uh, you know, these guys are just happy to be in the A and they're just living out uh trying to make it. And uh, you know, Connors I just his work ethic, it's infectious watching him. And uh obviously there's there's stuff to work on it, you know, some skill work, some skating. Uh, but it's it's not he's not gonna not make it from lack of trying, that's for sure.
Speaker 2:No, 100%. And I was even thinking, like, just with your team, because I know like the you know the dynamic of the NHL has changed and everything else, but you guys you guys with your young players, right? And you're on your young stars, and there's not really well, I shouldn't say I don't know your lineup very well, but doesn't seem like there's like any type of fear factor too much there, you know. Like, um is there room like again for a guy that wants to PK, wants to hit, you know, I mean somebody like Connor, like the I it seems like there's still like that could be a valuable resource for for a team, and maybe even Chicago, like to have somebody there, like man in man in that that type of job. I don't yeah. Without me well, yeah, you don't say we're just shooting the shit, right? You're not the GM and you're not doing anything, but I'm just saying, like as far as well, let's just not even say Chicago.
Speaker 1:I think there's room in the NHL for him.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:You know, that there is. Uh you know, I'm a huge Tom Wilson fan, obviously, besides some of the the suspensions, but you know, guys like that, I'm trying to think uh other guys around the league podsy that just yeah, there's room. Yeah, you know, it might not be Chicago, it might be, but there's he's just got to continue to work and get better on his skills. Uh, you know, we talk about wall work. Uh, you know, I think everybody can get better at that, especially you know, if he gets moved to the wing, he's playing center now. But if he gets moved to the wing, he's gonna have to get wall pucks out, pucks in, though, you know, those old things. But um I I really like the kid, and uh I I think he just works. He works. Um I gotta bring up this play podgy last weekend. There was a scrum net front uh in our defensive zone late in the game. Uh and this this guy basically had a yawning cage. And I was thinking, well, what would I have done? You know, a guy's got an empty net. Am I coming in? I'm gonna try and A, I'm gonna try and block the shot. B, I'm gonna try and get stick on puck. This guy put this kid into outer space with a body. Okay. I'm not gonna get it. Jordan Connor did Connor did. And he hit him so hard that this kid's helmet actually hit him as well. So both of them are like almost like a double KO. Anyways, the kid doesn't score, but it's like the third the third option was his first option.
Speaker 2:It was amazing. Oh, that's great. I want to uh I want to find that highlight now and we'll we'll clip it and show it on there.
Speaker 1:That'd be yeah, you gotta clip this. It's unbelievable.
Speaker 2:That sounds like it. I mean, and talking with him, yeah. I mean, I didn't want to mean to make this about Connor, but like talking with him, like he just he loves he loves that. Like he loves all of that, you know. Like it's not, you know, like he wants he wants to beat his old man's penalty minute record, you know. I mean, he gets to 10 fights before you know it. Like he he like he he really thoroughly enjoys that aspect of the game. And and that's what like I I get put a big and he's good at it, yeah, and he's good at it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it's not like he's not a good hockey player, he's good at at his role.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly. And that's the uh that's the thing. I I think uh whatever. I I think that there's a place for that, and even going back to that player identity thing, like everybody, I shouldn't say everybody, majority guys want to be something, you know, that that they potentially can't be because there's such a tight funnel there. That that's an area where I think the funnel's a little bit wider because there's opportunity for guys, you know, to do that, but way less guys want to, you know, which I think is uh is what shows up when you see a guy that has that fire in their eye and really loves doing that role and will do it anywhere, yeah. You know, without complaint. I think that's uh that's a valuable thing. Uh for sure. What do you think about that prospects game last night? Um, and how important is that for those players you think that are in there?
Speaker 1:I think there's a ton of pressure in that game. I think it's a little uh I never got the chance to play in one because they weren't around when we were playing, but I I I couldn't imagine walking into the saddle dome last night, knowing that I would say every GM was there last night. 32, right? You'd think yeah, oh yeah. Go going into that arena with 32 GMs with three or four scouts from every team. Um that's a lot, that's a lot to handle for a 17, 18 year old. And uh man, I I just I couldn't imagine Podzi.
Speaker 2:I I really couldn't yeah, and there's a lot of dynamics with that too, right? Like you're playing a team game. Like the one thing I saw, and I'm not saying it any one of these guys is selfish, but like I was thinking it was Preston and Hurlbert playing together, right? So you want to win the hockey game, but does anyone ever think about you know making not making that pass to give this guy that you're in competition with for draft order, you know, like the play back door? Like, I I don't think that I would you couldn't really process it that fast, and I think that if you're a real actual natural player, you're not gonna make those decisions, but I think that that dynamic is really weird there, too. They're not teammates, and even Herl Button playing for the U.S.
Speaker 1:team last year, right? So he's shooting on a goalie that he played with last year, right? Like it's just a weird, it's it was a weird dynamic, yeah. Um, anybody anybody stand out in your eyes?
Speaker 2:I only saw the third period, I forgot that it was on. So Hudson came in and he like showed me uh Preston's goal there at the end, and then I was like, that's when I watched the last six minutes. So Hudson watched the whole thing. I'm gonna watch the game on Wednesday, or no, tomorrow, I guess it is now. I'll watch the second one there because I forgot that it was on. Um, but yeah, in I mean, in the in the seven minutes, which was really the seven minutes that I watched, um, Preston looked good. Yeah, I mean he did. Yeah, he was moving the puck. And then that one kid on the uh uh Canada blue line, uh, which was a name. I don't think he's from the West, but boy, he was pretty slick up top, like real patience, nice hands on the scene. Yeah, Villeneuve. Villeneuve looked uh looked pretty nasty. I mean he's uh Carroll's had some good looks too.
Speaker 1:Uh yeah, he's he was.
Speaker 2:uh i liked him a lot as well and the villainouve kid was uh you know that lane hudson lane hudson we you know we kind of talked about it moving on the offensive blue line he looks to have uh a lot of that uh in him yeah a lot of swagger there a lot of uh he was dancing made one play there i said to Hudson I'm like oh my god that guy's got ice in his veins like you know totally last man back like oh yeah delay looks a guy off pulls it around like it was like the I think the net was empty at that point too yeah yeah and he was just high stepping crossing over yeah how about planters kids so uh were you were you there when Clinton was there oh yeah yeah yeah so that's pretty wild to see all his boys do so well hey I got to know Planter he was the assistant in Chicago last year as well yeah so uh I got to know him a little bit more but Zam and Max I believe yeah very uh very impressive start yeah and Victor right isn't the Victor the one that's on it playing right now is that the one on the US team yeah I think that's the one that's so there's the three of them right yeah Zam and Max I think are playing together right now in university I think yeah at Duluth yeah and then uh Victor's the guy that's now in in uh in his draft year I believe and and I had Max on my pod oh my god is he a beauty like an absolute beauty love nice yeah oh yeah he had me laughing like just dying and yeah I mean they're all doing awesome yeah great start uh great start for their college careers yeah aren't they one and two in points right now or something yeah how cool is that hey yeah well done I know well done good job planter so anyways we're talking for anyone who's listening like Derek Plant was uh a guy we played with at Manheim and uh with NHL I mean played with Buffalo did did the whole nine yards and uh so we know him and then now his kids are coming through and and being looks like they're being little world beat beaters so that's fun to see the next generation come through.
Speaker 1:Yeah they're uh and they look all just look just like them yeah it's crazy crazy crazy um so you've been in camps quite a bit hey you would we mean we talked about bam um i mean herlbert um he's been playing with with nathan bem who was one of your guys' guy was he a second rounder last third third round pick third round pick to to to camlips and uh i mean to chicago from camlips and uh those two seem to have some great chemistry going on there um and and doing really well what do you what are you seeing with the with that camlips group this year well i would say those two guys uh have a very their their hockey iq is is really high um they see plays and and they just just feed off each other um the last time i was out west they actually played the first game together and then they didn't the second game uh and then they went back the third game uh but it seems like they're been on the line pretty much the whole time since then um yeah just a good give and go you know tandem where they feed off each other uh little pick plays uh down low which i think and that's another thing uh that i think is crucial as well but that's not for today we'll do that at 267 um yeah they they they just they're real smart together uh like i said the give and goes uh in podzies you would know that like they give one timer passes uh they don't just rip it at each other right uh you know so if it you know if if uh herbut sees beam bame sorry with his stick gawked he you know he's not ripping it at him just lay it in there and and and you know let him have at it yeah uh you know which is a skill a one timer pass giving one is a skill yeah oh for sure it is yeah they these these two are they're they're uh real high end offensive players right now yeah that hockey IQ you mentioned like how I that's one thing for me like at the level I'm at where I'm having a bit of a hard time from the coaching perspective when it's like okay like I see a play you know through the coach's eyes or maybe I would see it as a player that I that I think is like a very easy read let's say right uh and they're not being made so like from a structure side as a coach or even from a development side it's like you know okay like you do these systems to create these opportunities and then when you don't recognize that opportunity like I I I don't know how to fill that gap right like it's there the structure was there to create this and now we're not seeing it um patience I I yeah I guess I just mean that like the hockey IQ piece is like boy is that a valuable piece to kind of have hey in in in the toolbox um maybe speak to that your your your version of that and and how it shows up uh at these you know more higher levels elite levels yeah I I just I think everybody thinks it on a different level um but I think there's growth to be made still um as coaches as player development guys uh having patience and and constant reminders constant teaching uh you know if it's through video on ice certain drills explaining the drills a certain way so they realize what you're trying to get out of it you know what we're not just doing this drill for you to skate around that cone through there and you know go bar down you know this is why we're doing it and I think that can sometimes make them smarter and you know kind of grow that hockey sense uh in a certain way um obviously I think there is naturals at it there is it's just the way it is um but I think I think it can grow I I do yeah I think that I think the watching of the hockey is is a big one I've been I've been kind of just ruminating on it a little bit just kind of in general because I'm trying to think like even when we played like and I hear some of the older guys like the give and go aspect of the game isn't really what it once was you know like as uh heard Huska talking about that the other day like that you know we were all about like you know giving the puck hopping into space now it's more of a cycle big long cycle game longer passes guys maybe don't use each other kind of independently as much and then you know I was thinking from my level of like thinking about the ability to scan you know you were talking about pre-scanning earlier like like seeing the macro um I think is it like that is something that has fallen behind.
Speaker 2:And then I'm starting to think like is it because they're like this all day long you know like the the their focus is is so here like and they're not they're not doing things kind of in the macro because you know for instance right a puck gets dumped in let's just say and there's a guy that's on your back and the other guy is on the is is on the uh strong side where your rim's gonna go and there's another guy over there and all it is is like a recognition of okay there's four guys that I can see which means that there's a lot of space behind me. You know what I mean like just like that simple kind of like area assessment of like where jerseys are and do I actually need to know where the winger is on this side or I just need to get the puck there because someone on my side's gonna get it because the number there should be some space there. There should be space right and there should be a guy because I see three here and I don't see two over there so it's got to be the guy's got to be there like those types of like reads I I I find are like I don't know it's just like how do you teach that right like that's the piece I'm like how do you teach that like how do we get this in the macro you count yeah a hundred percent you know I always use the thing as a D man you know you're in the neutral zone without the puck and the other team's coming up and I look and I count one two three four and then the pass gets zipped behind me and the guy's on a breakaway well you got to count to five do you know what I mean podzies if I'm just scanning if I'm scanning the ice I'm looking okay there's one two three four five okay perfect we're up by a goal I got five guys in front of me should be good yeah you know it's no i know it's I know it's crazy to say stuff like that but I can remember when I was coaching and you know the last five minutes of the game and I would just constantly remind the D count to five keep keep the five in front of you yeah and oh that's an easy way yeah it is that simple it's so crazy like I'm just thinking of some clips that we've shown this year right like on the like on the back check even like and I will say that I'm like what do you because you'll you'll watch it in the game and it looks like there isn't the recognition that this is an odd man rush ahead of me like how many jerseys are ahead of me right and how many of our jerseys are ahead of me what there's three so does that mean that you're three against two right so we need to add one to that picture right I know I'm laughing about it but like I that's honestly like what I like that's kind of like that's the piece to me I'm like how why why is this coat being coached like I shouldn't have to talk about this like when you put your head up and you see that it's three versus two like this should be an automatic instinct that I got to get in the picture. Right? But it's like it's sometimes for some guys it doesn't compute maybe you're tired maybe maybe you're not interested right maybe you're hoping for a turnover I guess um but I do think that some of that just like that pattern recognition I guess there's the word I'm looking for a pattern recognition.
Speaker 1:No right never assume I guess the other thing is never assume as coaches don't assume that they don't recognize that three and two is minus one like I guess the constant reminder of we need to add another one or even two guys to that picture.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah that would be our benefit for that recognition right yeah anyways buddy well you've been great thanks for coming on again for 167 after being guest seven uh for any of you who are interested like Andy's story is awesome like as a player and what he was able to do and and uh and really also quite interesting from the comes of the fact of like not that you didn't make it buddy but like why why not 10 years in the show right like why not um him and I both kind of share a little bit of a similar scenario there and now we're both involved in helping players you know kind of reach their their full potential but um that was a really good discussion I remember back in episode seven so if you want to go yeah that was please do that was good yep yeah for sure and uh anyways awesome to check in again god your family's doing well glad uh you as well podgy glad everything's happening there for you appreciate you getting on with me here again and uh have a great practice we'll do it yeah I gotta get to what'd you call it what recognition was that recognition of what of three and two doesn't add up oh it's a pattern recognition pattern recognition I like that pattern recognition you're gonna do it at practice today um no today's probably they're they're leaving all for turkey like half of them aren't even here yet because they left for with flights because American Thanksgiving oh that's right and obviously we're in Idaho so I think I got 11 guys today so I think we're probably gonna do some one on ones just to get them you know a little bit of a one-on-one day then give them some fun at the end maybe play some games awesome yeah well great podgy yep thanks for checking in we'll talk to you soon thank you so much for being here and listening to the entire episode of the Up My Hockey podcast uh with episode 167 with Andy Delmore. Uh it's great for me to catch up with Andy uh we've we've had a habit of that he'll he will call me on the road and we'll have a little catch up here and there but it's great to give him back on the pod and talk about what he's doing now. I hope you found it entertaining and helpful. Uh I really enjoy any conversation uh especially with with players uh players people like Andy who are doing it at the highest level with the best in the world I know there's always things that we can learn uh for wherever you are at in your journey whether you are a hockey parent or a hockey player or whether you're a a coach trying to help out I'm sure there's lots you could take away from our discussion there. So uh yeah enjoy have a great week and until next time play hard and keep your head up