Up My Hockey with Jason Podollan
Up My Hockey with Jason Podollan
EP.138 - Father's Legacy, Son's Ambition: The Journey of Josh Doan
Join us for an inside look into the life and career of Josh Doan, son of NHL legend Shane Doan, as he transforms from an overlooked prospect to a promising second-round NHL draft pick. Hear Josh's unique perspective on mastering the art of goal-scoring through relentless effort and the invaluable lessons learned from his father. Feel the excitement of his first NHL game, played in the very arena where he honed his skills in college.
Discover the gritty reality of striving for a spot in the NHL, from the rigorous training camps to the stark differences between the AHL and NHL lifestyles. Experience the camaraderie and mentorship that define a young player's journey, as Josh recounts the pivotal role of veteran players and the physical and emotional challenges faced in the AHL grind. This chapter sheds light on the determination and mental toughness required to transition from a late call-up to a key player.
As the conversation unfolds, we delve into the importance of cultivating team culture, building confidence, and embracing vulnerability. Learn how Josh navigates the pressures of draft years and the significance of supportive mentorship circles in fostering growth and resilience. We wrap up with uplifting stories of overcoming fear, the joy of creativity on the ice, and the balancing act between high performance and having fun. Tune in for a heartfelt testament to perseverance and the power of familial support in professional hockey.
I think pride and being good around the net. That's kind of the thing about having a dad who's been around. He can tell you you're going to make most of your money being in front of the net, so get good around there. If you can score 10 to 15 goals just by getting a stick on the puck or something or, yeah, stick on puck or banging something in then it's going to benefit you. And it might not be the prettiest way to score goals, but they all count the same. So it's something that I've worked on and and Kyle Bocek, our skills guy here, him and I when I was up with with the, with the NHL team, we worked like every day on on different net front drills and rebounds and bouncing pucks and stuff like that, and it's one of those things that, uh, it takes a lot of work, but something that I take some pride in now.
Speaker 2:That was Utah Hockey Club member, josh Doan, and you are listening to episode 138 of the Up my Hockey podcast with Jason Padolan. Welcome to Up my Hockey with Jason Padolan, where we deconstruct the NHL journey, discuss what it takes to make it and have a few laughs along the way. I'm your host, jason Padolan, a 31st overall draft pick who played 41 NHL games but thought he was destined for 1,000. Learn from my story and those of my guests. This is a hockey podcast about reaching your potential. Hello and welcome back, or welcome to the At my Hockey podcast with Jason Padolan. I am your host, jason Padolan, and we are here for episode 138 with Josh Doan. This is the first time on the podcast that I have had the Hall of Fame father and the up coming prospect on both on as guests, so that's pretty exciting for me. I don't know Josh at all. Prior to this interview, I connected with him through Shane, who I know well enough to text and to ask, and Josh was amazing with the yes. He was excited to do it and wanted to do it, which isn't always the case. So super cool by Josh to want to come on, want to share his story with someone that he hasn't met before and I'm really happy we're able to provide the discussion for you. His story, josh's, is really, really cool in a lot of ways. So, know one, not everybody has a father that's played 20 years in the NHL. Uh, not everyone plays hockey in, uh, the town where his father has been a pro and gets drafted by the team where his father has been a pro, who later then goes to university in the same town where he grew up and where his father was a pro, and then, of all things, to have your first call-up, be in the NCAA university arena that you attended for two years for your first NHL game. Very, very strange in a lot of ways and also super cool.
Speaker 2:Josh was a late bloomer and that's something that for anyone listening right now that maybe is on the smaller side or hasn't grown yet, if you're a youth hockey player, I guess that was Josh's story and we talk about that the idea of still being relevant and sticking around long enough and figuring out how to play that game and overcoming the fears that are involved in that playing against players that are bigger, heavier, stronger than you. That's real-world stuff and was josh's scenario growing up and and even his story. I mean, he was a late bloomer in the fact that, yes, he was good enough to play in the ushl, which is a great league, uh, in the united states, at 17 years old, but he wasn't good enough to get drafted at 17 years old. You know, he he was playing for the Chicago Steel. He had a 45-game season where he produced five goals and nine assists, 14 points in the USHL in his draft year, completely disregarded by the NHL community. Even with an NHL father of 20 years, they didn't think that he was prospect worthy and no one drafted him, not even in the later rounds. Uh, he was I mean josh who speaks to this and I I won't paraphrase him uh, extensively, but you know he mentioned that he thought maybe there was a chance but most likely he probably wouldn't go. You know that that was, that was his own personal expectation from that draft. And then the next year uh started off kind of okay, I guess, and then really started to pick it up and I guess he grew that year and I guess he got stronger that year and I guess a lot of things started to come together for him. And the next season, with the Chicago Steel, he played a 53-game season 31 goals, 39 assists for 70 points well over a point-a-game average and from being undrafted in his first year of eligibility, he flew all the way up to a second-round pick and being selected 37th overall as an 18-year-old in the 2021 draft by the Arizona Coyotes. So what a cool story that is.
Speaker 2:That is very rare for that to happen to be passed over and then to be drafted that high in the span of 12 months. So a lot of things can happen to be passed over and then to be drafted that high in the span of 12 months. So a lot of things can happen. Hockey players in a span of 12 months. My previous guest, luke Buss. He went from being decommitted in a span of 12 months to being like a guy that was supposed to go to a premier university, to not being wanted by that university and then having to reinvent himself another 12 months or eight months and be selected again to go to a new university because he was able to reinvent his game. So there's so much that can happen to hockey players and I just want everyone to keep that in mind. And that's good and bad. We can come become complacent and things can go south for us, or we can hit the grind and we can really buy into our development and really focus on our goals and dreams and maybe we get a growth spurt in there, maybe we start putting on some weight and lots of things can happen. We can have spikes in our skill development. We can have spikes in our skating. There's lots of things that can happen. So you just got to ride the course and and stay true to your passion, and that's obviously what Josh did.
Speaker 2:Josh went from there to the Arizona State University where he wanted to go Again. It was his hometown university. He always wanted to play there, had two good seasons there and then opted to go to the AHL and play for Tucson, which is a fantastic choice in my opinion. We cover his AHL journey fairly extensively. We cover his AHL journey fairly extensively that it is such a great place to develop, a great place to appreciate the game and the veterans that are involved there and what it takes to play the game professionally, and also, if you are lucky enough to get that call to the NHL, how much more you appreciate the environment that you're in from being on the journey and on the bus in the AHL. So it really keeps your perspective in check and I think it will really help Josh moving forward with his goal of becoming a full-time NHLer. I think that perspective of understanding what the AHL is and doing everything that he can to stay there and really appreciating the moment will do him wonders. And that's where Josh is at.
Speaker 2:He got called up from Tucson last year. He had a really great rookie season in the AHL uh, full, uh, his full first time through a full year in the AHL, had 26 goals in 62 games. I believe he was second only to Logan Stankoven uh, in AHL rookie scoring. We all know what Logan Stankoven did when he got called up to Dallas and had a great playoff run there. So that's a great shadow to be in. And Josh essentially followed in Logan's footsteps. When he got called up, he just put up huge numbers. He had two goals his first game. He ended up with nine points in 11 games A fantastic start to his NHL career. And now, as this podcast is being released, he is at camp and trying to make an impression there to become a full-time NHLer this year with Utah.
Speaker 2:So really fun story. He's super candid, really honest, really forthcoming, with real information. That is obviously what I feel the benefit of this long-form type of discussion is and my podcast in particular is that I get to ask the follow-up questions, I get to dive a little deeper and get get past the uh you know, the initial response to get to the, to the meat of things. And Josh allowed me to do that and he was, he was really awesome uh in this interview. So, uh, without further ado, um, you know, like father, like son Shane, shane is recognized throughout the hockey world as one of the best people in the game. If you listen to his interview, I think you're going to hear a lot of you know Josh, or a lot of Shane in Josh. And obviously the apple didn't fall too far from the tree, because anyone who knows the Doans knows that that's a really good family and Josh is living up to that, to that hype and reputation. So I hope you enjoyed this discussion. Without further ado, here is my conversation with.
Speaker 2:Josh Doan. All right, here we are for episode 138, with Josh Doan, son of former NHLer Shane.
Speaker 1:Doan Josh, really excited to have you on the program.
Speaker 2:Thanks for being here today. Yeah, thanks for having me. Yeah, man, no problem, I know that you're uh in utah, all settled up. Uh, what? What are the feelings on this year and the change? There's so much going on for you guys.
Speaker 1:It's new and exciting yeah, it's been awesome so far. The people here are so friendly and excited. You, you kind of walk around and and people know the team and they're excited for the team to be here, so that's that's always exciting. And we're at a pretty cool spot. We're training and skating at the olympic oval, so the us olympic speed skating team is is around us and it's pretty fascinating to watch them. They they can move pretty, pretty good yeah, no kidding.
Speaker 2:So with you and, and maybe we'll just like start there, like actually where you're at right now. So you're, you're in Utah, you're getting ready for the season. You were a late call-up at the end of last year and had a lot of success there. What's the message for this year from the club? What are the expectations for you?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it's one of those things. You've got to come in and have a good camp. Obviously, no spot in this league is ever safe, so you've got to come in and have a good camp. Obviously it's no, no spot in this league is ever safe. So you got to come in and earn, earn your right to be there. And that's kind of the focal point for me is to to re-earn anything that, anything that I thought last year and and try to prove a point that I had a good summer and I can carry over what I did last year.
Speaker 2:Awesome. So from you as a personal, like your mindset, maybe it goes without saying, but like you want to be an NHLer this year, you want to be a Utah Hockey Club member, and that's where your sights are set.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think my main goal is to prove that I belong and I can play at that level. It's something that I guess it's every kid's dream, obviously to play in the NHL. So when you're this close, it's one of those things you got to step back and and and rethink and kind of tell yourself that this is probably the hardest. Hardest part of it is the next couple of steps. Even though you're the closest to being in the NHL, it's it's going to be the hardest, hardest step for me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, that's a mature way to think of it. I'm sure your dad's had some had some counsel with you there too. You know, like you've you've been I mean, technically you're a part of the club, right, I mean you've played NHL games. Now you've, you know you've scored the NHL goal. You've, you've done it. You've, you've worn the sweater, which is super cool, congratulations on that. But again, um, I know the one thing that I was never told, and, and, uh, it would have been so awesome if I was. But like the get a place, uh, discussion with the general manager. You know, like, hey, you are here, we want you to stay here. Uh, has that conversation happened? I know you're in a condo now, like or is that just you getting ready for the season and being as prepared as you can be?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm good buddies with Michael Kessler, who was on the team last year. He earned his rank last year and signed a deal, a two-year contract, with the team at the end of the year. He bought a townhouse, so I was sent out here early to help him unpack everything and fortunate enough, he's let me stay here through camp and hopefully throughout the season if everything goes well. But it's one of those things where that conversation will either be had or not had by the end of training camp and hopefully it's a good one. But as for now, just go in there, work hard and see what happens.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love it. I guess we're working backwards. Usually, chronologically, I start when you're younger, but we're working backwards right now. So, like I'd love to hear about last year, you know, being a Tucson Roadrunner. You know we'll get to your university career as well and maybe your decision to play there. But pro hockey, you, you know the ahl level. In some aspects it, it can be more difficult than the nhl level. Um, you know, whether it be the travel, whether it be the accommodations, whether it be the food, you know I mean like the the game itself sometimes can be a little bit more difficult, sometimes more physical. Uh, what was the adjustment like for you to the ahl level? And and what did you learn there?
Speaker 1:that that was different than the NCAA yeah, I mean, I think the first thing is like there's the best people in the world down in the AHL that you get to meet and and guys that play the game because they love it and and they and they battle hard like it's it's no joke the AHL.
Speaker 1:And when you go down there, you, you learn and it almost it makes you want it more, because you get a taste of the nhl and and you see how amazing it can be in the experience and the travel and the accommodations, compared to one step below where you're busing six hours, your meal is is a random hotel meal from from a best western or something like that, and and then you got to go play back-to-back against grown men that are still trying to prove themselves and prove that they belong in the NHL, and everyone's out there and trying to make statements. So there's no night off. Every game is a bloodbath and if you love the game of hockey, it's so fun because you're in the thick of it, no matter what, and every night's a big game, it's, it's a riot, and and you learn how to, how to love the game for what it is because you are, you are battle tested and when you finally make that jump you.
Speaker 2:you learn to love it a little bit more at the next level yeah, boy, you touched on a lot of things there which I think probably require a little bit more insight.
Speaker 2:You know, the one is is, like, just for the more, the average fan, or maybe even like the average junior hockey player out there, playing, like you mentioned, the one step, like it's legitimately like your one phone call, one injury, one, whatever, away from you know, the greatest league in the world, and not only does, like, your paycheck dramatically change with that one phone call, but the experience of being a hockey player dramatically changes, right, like you're not on buses and traveling eight hours and eating on the bus and ordering your food from the rink, and you know, I mean all the stuff that happens with that. You're flying in charter planes with, with, with shrimp, caviar, and you mean all the rest of it. Like it's just such a mind-blowing difference just by the fact, by the chance that you might get a phone call. Um, can you just talk about chance that you might get a phone call? Can you just talk about that? Because you did experience that last year, right, like from the AHL to the NHL. Like, what was that like as a young man experiencing that difference?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think the first time I really noticed it. Obviously my dad would tell me stories as a kid and I was kind of like, yeah, like, whatever, like it's, I'm sure it's nice, nice, but he was never like really saying it. And it goes like I got called up in San Jose. After back-to-back there, we, we flew to San Jose. Or we flew to Bakersfield, played Bakersfield, drove down to like San Diego, played San Diego, flew up from San Diego to to, uh, san Jose played them. And it was like you're getting a full AHL experience where, as a young guy, I'm flying for Southwest, I'm middle seat the whole way because I'm between two older guys. That's kind of how it goes. And then we play San Jose, they get called up. They're like they asked if I wanted to fly out that night and I had all my stuff there.
Speaker 1:So I was like I'll fly out the next day with the team in Tucson and then drive up from Tucson because we were going home. So then I flew from San Jose to Las Vegas in a middle seat between two veterans, and then from Vegas to Tucson in the middle seat. And you're in there because they're bigger guys, everyone's it's a, it's pro hockey, so no one's little. And then I drove up from Tucson to Arizona to play a couple games and you kind of learn like.
Speaker 1:You get to the practice facility. There's breakfast made for everybody, whatever you want to order, the team chef will do it. And then, and then you practice and you can take home whatever you want any drink really you can think of like sports energy drink to prepare for the game, which you're not getting in the AHL. And then, after a couple games at home, you drive to a private airport, walk onto the plane, you sit in your own seat, there's people are bringing you whatever you need and you're flying to your game. And then after that you fly right out after the game and you go to the next location where it's like, and it's like, oh, like, some guys are kind of upset that they got to fly out that night to go play. I, some guys are kind of upset that they got to fly out that night to go play. I mean this is great. Like I was bought in six hours of next game like a week ago, so I would love it. Like I'm getting a full sleep on the plane. It's but, it's.
Speaker 1:And then my dad after calls me and he laughs, he's like so this is. You're finally kind of seeing what it's like. Hey, like, and I'm like, yeah, I don't have any sympathy for you anymore. Like this is legit, so it's and it's just, and, like you said, it's one call, like it takes legit one phone call or or one injury, or are you to have a couple of big games in a row to get a chance? And and you look at some of the guys that have came through Tucson and Arizona that earned their chance, like Connor Garland and and Michael Bunting and Michael Carconi, and there's some big name guys Matthias Michelli, that that they serve their ranks in the AHL and they've never looked back since and it's it's you kind of see why they they've worked as hard as they have to stick yeah, yeah, I mean I do one of the things I really do respect about your old man and for you know any of those guys that have done.
Speaker 2:What you just said is like your dad experienced the minors, right, like he experienced the minors after being in the nhl for a season or two, I can't remember exactly but like, like that's a big wow, you know, like to go back and to and for him to rebuild himself and to find a way back to the nhl and have the career that he did. Uh. But there's some guys, right, I mean not that I'm going to make fun of those guys, but the silver spooners, who have never been in the ahl, don't know what that's like, you know, don't know what it's like to be on the buses there and to have that experience. Like those guys are usually a little more quick to complain about the travel and everything else, right yeah, oh, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:So I credit guys like my dad and guys like like.
Speaker 1:I played with dylan through this year and he had an incredible year last year in the nhl, went back to play junior, had a good training kick they wanted him to get a little bit more experience in the nhl and then came down and had just an amazing time with the guys and was in every day in the room happy and smiling and and then he goes up and he scores 17 goals or whatever it is in the back half of an NHL season and and he's like, he's a guy who loves the game.
Speaker 1:You beat players and people who love the game of hockey Cause they don't like you don't get all that special treatment. You're there cause you want to play hockey and and when you kind of make it out of that you you get this, the special treatment, and you love playing hockey and the combination of it makes it so much better and I think that's part of the AHL, that that sets guys apart from other players and and you see, guys play a long, long career after they play at the AHL yeah, there's been lots of stories.
Speaker 2:I've had lots of guests on this program, as you know, with me in episode 137 and uh and and some of the best stories. Like you mean, I don't know, jared smithson comes to mind right away, a guy that played a long time in the nhl before he played his 700 games in the nhl. I mean scott nichols, another guy but these guys really learned, like, the essence of the game at the ahL level from the guys that had been pros you know what I mean and maybe, maybe, maybe a cup of coffee right in the NHL, maybe maybe a half a season here and there. But they were the 32 year old guy that was playing in the AHL that, like you know, like you said, like knew when to show up, knew what time to be at the rank, knew what the work required was to play consistently all the time and and they just said the the lessons from those guys and being around those guys really helped them in their journey. Can you speak to that at all with your experience in Tucson?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean it's been so far. You do learn how to take care of your body. I think is the first thing from those older guys that have been up and down and and you don't get the special treatment again like the massages. So you got to learn how to take care of your body yourself and show up to the rink early and and get you working.
Speaker 1:But, like, my first captain in pro hockey was adam cracknell and he's been, he's been around for a while and he was the guy right right away kind of showed me he was the first guy on the ice every day working on different things and and working on goalie shooting and stuff like that with the goalies and it's like and you see why he's he's done so well and last his best ahl season was the year I was with him.
Speaker 1:He had over 50 points for the first time ever at 30 something years old it's and it's it just goes to show like it's it's guys that take care of their bodies and they show up every day and and he made sure that everyone felt important and was having fun in the rink and and that's kind of how how he just is a guy, but it's the reason his career has been been so prominent in my opinion. And but you do learn, like the little things of of when to show up and what, how to, how to feed your body, how to take care of your body away from the rink, and and then when you're at your rink, at the rink what what kind of do and and and who to see and who to listen to and and what guys can you get advice?
Speaker 1:and you kind of just have to be a sponge when you're down there and soak in all the, all the experiments and and or experience and and stories that guys will tell you, because you said you'll get the best stories in the world from from the ahl yeah, yeah, and you know what and I don't know, I mean I was a little naive to that and maybe you can speak to that or not.
Speaker 2:but like, just as a young guy and I was a second rounder and, you know, kind of a top prospect and was successful at younger levels and when I got to the ahl not that I disrespected the older guys, I didn't at all but I didn't respect how hard it was to play the game that long at that level, you know, like to actually be there at 30, 32, 33, right, like that was lost on me. You know, I kind of thought that it was easy, kind of, or it would be easy, you know. And boy, like that's the thing, like, as I had more experience and gained more experience, I really found more of that like really utter respect for those guys that are able to play, you know, because it's freaking hard man, it's hard.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, it's really hard. I think that's like once you learn the respect to those guys, I think you start to learn a little bit more. But, like in the NHL, you go to the net, you're getting pounded, Like it's not an easy game to play. I argue that it's the most physical league in the world, because everyone wants to prove a point and everyone's trying to prove a different point, right. There's some guys trying to prove they can be the toughest guy in the world and they need to be in the NHL. There's some guys that want to be heavy defensemen.
Speaker 1:But then you've got guys that are more skilled than 90% NHL guys down there. They just haven't pieced it together in the NHL or haven't figured it out completely and and they can make you look like an idiot out on the ice at any given moment because they got there's some sick mitts out there and that, and then there's guys got to watch out for, like killing you and it's a hard game but it makes it so much fun and and after it's not as serious after games compared to the NHL you can laugh and talk about certain things that happened to you or someone else during the game. You're like I can't believe that happened or whatnot, but it's so fun. I loved my time down there the last year.
Speaker 2:Yeah, good for you. Yeah, I mean, that's the thing too. People assume that the best players are in the NHL. I guess it is true, but there's also, like great examples that you just said of, like amazing hockey players that, for whatever reason, are not in the NHL and, whether that be opportunity, or in the wrong team or the wrong system at the wrong time, maybe didn't make the most of an opportunity in the moment. You know what I mean. And they're there and they're all fighting for this spot. So that's definitely not a league to be frowned upon. And, to your point too, like the guys, some guys are fighting to get to the next level, some guys are fighting to stay at that level, right, so everyone's fighting for something there, right, like nobody's really comfortable in that scenario.
Speaker 2:When it comes to just the shift to Utah, I want to focus on that for a second, because there is a guy by the name of Dave Oliver who's a friend of mine.
Speaker 2:I'm not sure if that name rings a bell to you or not, but he's a. He's a pro scout for the Coyotes and, yeah, I talked with him about you a little bit when I when I knew that I was going to be interviewing you and anyways, outside of what we talked about with you, which I'll share with you, he just talked about the move from Phoenixoenix to utah and and he didn't mean it disparagingly to phoenix at all or to the area, but he just said like utah feels like we're really in the nhl now. You know, it was kind of like the way he said it, like just the facility and where it's at and kind of the buzz around it and you know you're not sharing a facility with. You know the university team, you know like what was happening down there, like do you feel like a definite difference of where you're at now and where that, where that team is, and how the ownership has has been treating the guys?
Speaker 1:yeah, I mean I, I think firstly the smith family. They think you you can compare them to the elite of the nba owners and that's a whole nother echelon of ownership, like the nba is is top class and and you can ask any nba and any nba player, staff member and they'll put him up in the in the top of the top for that and and then he welcomed us with with open arms and has been amazing right from the beginning and and kind of the idea of what he wants to do he's shared with us and kept us in the loop for everything and it's like it's spectacular what he wants to do and and he wants to do it for the city of Utah. That's his home, which makes it even cooler. His family's here. He wants to build it in Utah and that's just something that you're getting where you've got a stable ownership that obviously Arizona was looking for for so long.
Speaker 1:I grew up when they were looking for a new place to play and they had new owners and the league owned them at one point. So it's one of those things right where it's nice to kind of have a sense of grounding to, to where you're at. But the the treatment level is is they have the facilities to do it like the mullet I love mullet more than anybody.
Speaker 1:Like it's it was my home, like that's where I played forever, but and you're sharing it with with asu and and I didn't have an issue with it because that was my school. But there's some guys and people that this is the NHL they want. They want NHL facilities. They don't want to be in a rental room in the corner or in an outside building. So when you kind of get your own pieces and your own and just your own everything, it makes a difference and I'm sure the staff and everything there's a little bit different treatment compared to how they're traveling in and out to watch teams play and the technology in terms of what they're getting to scout is a little bit different because of the Smith group and their technology side of things. They're pretty invested in that. So I'm sure everyone's feeling that it's a treatment to a different level.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love it. I love that you're feeling that. That's something that dave mentioned. He said this guy just seems it's just a different vibe, it's a different energy right, like what he wants to do with it and it's and it's exciting, right, and I'm sure it is an exciting time, uh, to be to be in the utah hockey club. Hey there, just a short break from the conversation to celebrate an exciting time of year, which is the start of hockey season.
Speaker 2:I know all across north america right now there are teams that have been formed, teams that are starting to take the ice and are looking forward to having an amazing season. With every new season becomes new comes new opportunities, new opportunities to make friends, new opportunities to build relationships, new opportunities to improve and opportunities to win championships, tournaments, games, etc. And have a super successful season on the ice. One of the ways to do that, of course, is to treat this season differently, and one way to treat it differently and to set the standard early on in the process is to create a culture, a mindset of high performance, and Up my Hockey can help you do that If you are a competitive team anywhere in North America and you want to give your players the mindset, tools and strategies available to have the best season that they have had yet and to win the tournaments and to have success and to minimize problems in the dressing room and have an amazing experience then Up my Hockey could be something that you were looking for. It's a four-week program that the players will look at online individually in their own homes and, if you so choose, you can bring me into an online Zoom meeting after each weeks of content for a coaching call where we have mini breakout rooms. We have sessions where the players get to know each other in ways that they wouldn't otherwise. I ask questions that provide value to the dressing room, value to each other as teammates, value to how to approach competition, how to approach preparation, how to be resilient as a group, how to push each other to become your best individually and as a team. There's a lot of stuff that we will break down and provide a framework and an infrastructure for your team to be successful this year. So if that sounds like something you would like to do four weeks at the start of the year, which actually breaks down to eight, great to start in October, november and get this done in the first half really establish the culture that you would like, then look up opmyhockeycom and you can get a hold of me through there and see if it is a good fit or not. Let's have this season be the best season yet.
Speaker 2:Now let's get back to the conversation with Josh Doan, with Tucson, and you had a heck of a year last year. You know. Congrats to you. You know 26 goals, 20 assists, um, in a tough league, as we, as we spoke about, as a essentially a rookie in that league, you got the opportunity, uh, with that call up and boy, you came in smoking buddy, like you know, being able to score like, I think, maybe two of your first game, if I remember correctly, and then and then ended up with nine points in 11 games. Like shit, bro, that's like a 60-point season if you did that for the entire time. Right, like that's crazy numbers. Just talk about that. Like that first game, feeling like being able to get that goal, like what was it? Was it just everything just kind of coming together at the right time or what was going on with you?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it was a little bit of like I was starting to feel more confident down in Tucson up until that point, like my game was kind of coming along and I was just kind of figuring out that pro hockey a little bit more. And then I got the call. I'm like all right, this is. I was nervous right away from when I got the call and then I got to Arizona and I slept in my own bed that I grew up in and I went.
Speaker 1:Our first practice before pregame skate was at the ice den where I grew up playing, and everything kind of felt like it was like this is kind of surreal but it feels normal at the same time, like I've done this before. And then I almost missed our first game, which is one of the things that doesn't I don't know if it really talked about. There was like there's construction on the highway going to do the rink and there's never construction and I left early, cause I like to get to the rink early. I left an hour and a half before the game before we had to be there, so it'd be there at five after three, 30 and get on the highway and then we stopped moving and there was a car crash in the construction, so no one was moving and my estimated time of arrival ended up being 6.54. At one point.
Speaker 1:But then there was a bunch of guys stuck and our head coach was stuck too. So I was like all right, I'm safe for now. And then it cleared up and I got there at 5 o'clock. So I sat in traffic for an hour and a half for my first game. It kind in traffic for an hour and a half from my first game.
Speaker 1:I'm like it kind of calmed my nerves a little bit. I'm like all right now that I'm here just play hockey like nothing matters. At least I made it, yeah, but my dad was just he. He was the one who kind of calmed my nerves. He's like, is it just play? He's who's scared? Who cares if you score? Who cares if we turn the puck over? First game. You're just supposed to go have fun and enjoy the, enjoy the night, enjoy the moment. And I was fortunate enough to play with with Matthias Michelli and Jack McBain, who are they're pretty elite players and they create space on the ice. So it was a fun game and it's one of those nights and days that you never forget. Every little detail of the day is going to be stuck in your head forever. So I it was.
Speaker 2:It was pretty cool that is awesome and one of the things for me, just because, uh, as you know, I know your dad not that we're super tight or anything, but you know we know him well enough to know him um, like his, his response and his reaction in the booth there, right, like isn't that wild, you know? Hey, don't worry about it, no one expects you to score a goal, just go have fun.
Speaker 2:Yet, yeah I mean it really you do really see how much that matters. Right like to get that goal and what that meant to him, even to see you be able to score that goal in that jersey it was. It was pretty special moment to watch from the outside. I can imagine how that was as a family yeah, he was leaving.
Speaker 1:He said he was going to leave the suite because I missed a breakaway right before he scored and then he thought we lost the puck and he's like. He was like I wasn't upset with music, but I was upset because I know how mad you'd be, so he was getting up to leave and then he turns around. That's why he's standing up when I score. He's like the only reason I'm standing is leaving the suite at the time. So it's one of those things where I'm like it just happens like there's no control. It's one of those crazy moments where it's a bang, bang play and it almost is better than it happens that quick. That way you don't have to like walk in and feel the pressure as you're walking down the middle or something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, awesome yeah, and it was a deflection, right, wasn't your first one at a flexion?
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was like, uh, out of the corner, I knocked off a stick and it went up in the air and I I whacked it out of the air.
Speaker 2:Do so I think I had two goals without shooting the puck into the net, which is always nice and you know what, which is maybe a good segue for dave oliver, because he had the chance to watch you in tucson and he had a chance to you know, senior, develop as a, as a pro, and and, uh, he just said that's one of your like, that's you, he's like really, he's like josh is a guy that's like really, really good in front of the net, like really high hockey iq. He said like, sees the game really well and and seems to get a stick on anything. So I mean, uh, you know, watching that me, not watching you anywhere at any point in your career um, those, those goals might have seemed like I don't know, lucky, fortuitous, whatever you want to say, but it sounds like you've been scoring those types of goals for a while yeah, I think pride and being good around the net.
Speaker 1:That's's kind of the thing about having a dad who's been around. He can tell you you're going to make most of your money being in front of the net, so get good around there. If you can score 10 to 15 goals just by getting a stick on the puck or banging something in, then it's going to benefit you. It might not be the prettiest way to score goals, but they all count the same. It's something that I've worked on and Kyle Bocek, our skills guy here, him and I when I was up with the NHL team, we worked like every day on different net front drills and rebounds and bouncing pucks and stuff like that, and it's one of those things that it takes a lot of work, but something that I take some pride in now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, just ask Zach Hyman how that's working out for him. Yeah exactly.
Speaker 1:He scores a thousand goals in front of the net. It's pretty impressive.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I mean, I love it. I mean that's exactly that's sage advice. Right there, right, Like, where does the puck end up? It ends up there, and how many guys score off a clean shot? Not many, you know. So a lot of those goals are in front of the net, got to get in front um.
Speaker 2:So as far as maybe we'll go back, I guess I mean lots of lessons in the ahl. I mean, uh, obviously I wish that you, you, you make the team this year and you don't ever have to be there again. But I'm glad you had that experience. You know there's, there's a lot of stuff to learn in the a. Um going back again, like what a crazy experience, like for you to play at asu and then all of a sudden the nhl team that you play for is playing at asu and you know and and and that's who drafts you and and all the rest of that.
Speaker 2:Like, um, arizona state obviously seems like a very natural progression for someone who played hockey, you know, in in phoenix, right, like, of course, okay, that that, maybe that makes some sense. My question was going to be maybe even like that predates the ncaa, with your dad being a camel's blazer, with you having the option of probably going to the whl. Uh, how did that? Was it ever a discussion? Was it ever a consideration to follow in dad's footsteps and go to the dub?
Speaker 1:yeah, I was like 17 years old, it was going into my senior year, high school, and our grade 12 and and I was set on going to Kamloops because I was drafted by Kamloops. They own my rights. I was going to live with my aunt and uncle, or my nana, papa. They both, they all live in Kamloops. I'm like, oh, this is perfect, like a good segue to do that. And ASU they'd been talking to me a little bit and if I was going to go to ASU I was going to play in the BCHL. I wasn't really ready for the USHL.
Speaker 1:And then Ryan Hardy, who was the GM of Chicago Steel at the time, when my rights called, my dad and I and they must have lost a guy or someone dropped out and they set up a phone call with us and were like, hey, we take our development pretty serious and we'll sit down on a Zoom and talk about your options and what it could be. And we were out of respect, like yeah, we'll talk and we'll see what he has to say. And by the end of that call it was my whole mindset had switched from going dub to going to Chicago and then committing to ASU because I could do that as well with the Steel. Our mindset was first I was only going to play one game a weekend. The other game I was going to be in the gym while they were playing to get stronger because it wasn't strong enough.
Speaker 1:As the year went on, I developed. We had an unbelievable team. Owen Power was on our team. We had Matt Coronado, mackie Samuskiewicz, brandon Bresson, sam Colangelo. It was just a stacked team that if you play versus better players then you're going to get better. That's kind of been my mindset throughout my career.
Speaker 1:You kind of want to be uncomfortable with who you're playing against, because you're going to find a way to adapt and to compete at that level. It was the best decision that I could have made was going to Chicago and learning from some of the guys there but it was it was legit. I was like I woke up and I'm like I'm gonna sign with Kamloops tonight and then, out of nowhere, nope, I'm not. I'm committing to ASU in a week and going to Chicago that's crazy.
Speaker 2:That's crazy. So, like the power of communication, right and and um and who knows? Like not knowing what you don't know. How was dad dad with that? Like obviously he supported it in some aspect, but he must have been excited about the idea of you going to Kamloops as well.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, I think he wanted me to go to Kamloops. My mom was like college all the way, like she was from the beginning so you need your degree, whatever, but she's from Kamloops. So the only team she'd let me play for was Kamloops. She's like if you go to Kamloops it's fine, but that's it. Like that was it, and so it was like one of those things where Chicago did a good job of kind of talking me into that and then ASU had came and visited me a couple times and talked with me and my family and we we went down to the school and my first time ever seeing the ASU campus was my first visit to see, like official visit, and it's 25 minutes away from home and I had no idea what it was like and once we got there it was like that also sweetened the deal, I think a little bit was seeing how many facilities they have and the tools and resources that they can give.
Speaker 2:Yeah, right, right, but kind of a small hockey world story. But of all teams that drafted, my oldest son, kamloloops, drafted Hudson. Yeah, you were saying that, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's so exciting. I mean it's a great spot. The city loves their hockey. I think my favorite story ever is my dad got stopped in a grocery store with me and him when we were training at the end of his career and he was probably in the NHL for 20 years at the time and his fans stopped him and was like hey, and asked are you Shane Doan? He's like yeah, and he's like, oh, I was the biggest fan of the Blazers when you played there. Like I was so happy when you won the M-Cup. And then he goes. So what do you do now? And my dad's like, oh, he's like, yeah, I've been playing for a while now.
Speaker 1:This is the end of his career and they just once you leave campbell's, they don't, they don't care, like you're not on their team anymore, it doesn't matter, they're just diehard blazer fans. So that's part of whl and the chl hockey which makes it so special so I I was laughing. I'm like this guy's got no idea that he plays hockey still. But he knew when he played with the blazers.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly not a bad player. Hey, not a bad player still playing.
Speaker 2:I was like take that, dad, yeah so with, with the uh, with the chicago steel. So I think this is a really, for me at least, this is a really compelling piece of your story, like, so you go there to chicago. You said that you want. I mean, the plan changed as you were there, like you were only going to play one game a week and you started playing more. And just keep I'm going to keep in mind for everybody you went there during your NHL draft year. Yeah Right, so your first year of eligibility. So walk me through where you're at. Like, just in that sort of evolution of you as a hockey player I mean, you're not naive to the idea that it's your draft year. You're going to be playing in this great league, the USHL. Your dad is a hall of famer, like, and now it's your kind of turn. Like, did you, did you not feel ready to get drafted? Like, where was your mindset when it came to that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I was like such a late bloomer, which was part of the issue. Yeah, I, I was like such a late bloomer, which was part of the issue, like I was. My draft year in the dub in the ushl was I was 5'4, 115 pounds and I probably when I went into the ushl I was just under 5'10 and probably 170 pounds, 165 pounds and it was one of those things I was like I wasn't. I knew in my own head like I'm not ready to go out there and dominate and be a top three round pick. I'm like I could try and prove that I can be something they can develop in the later rounds and just get an opportunity somewhere. And trying to prove someone right was my mindset.
Speaker 1:And as the year progressed I talked to a couple of teams here and there, but nothing too serious, where it was like I wasn't really expecting much when it came to the draft and and then as the year went on, it was like we had guys that were going to go the first couple rounds and brandon breshawn went the first round to to vegas, sam clangil was like the second or third pick in the second round and and they're guys that I had played with and competed with all year and I'm like I can, I can try and compete with them, but they're they're going to be the high-end picks. I'll kind of slide in and hopefully be a seventh rounder was my hope. And then I didn't have a great year. I think I had five goals and 14 points, or whatever. It is my first year, which by no means is me expecting to get drafted in the NHL, so I was like whatever.
Speaker 1:And then COVID came, which screwed everything up and it was like everything was shut down and and I think it was one of the biggest things that benefited my game was was COVID and and getting to kind of work out and train a little bit longer, have a longer summer to prepare for the following year and try and be a draft plus one guy and then thankfully had a big second year right, yeah, that's okay.
Speaker 2:So that's super cool because it does happen. Of course, the guys you know get passed over their first year of eligibility, but it's it's quite rare to have the second year of eligibility. Be a guy that's going to go 37th overall. Right, like that, you know, like from from not on the board to 37th is like is a huge, huge meter meteoric rise. So awesome on that. What was the big transformation for you? What's the difference between 14 points and 70 points, between five goals and 31 goals? What happened to Josh Doan? You mentioned COVID in the training, but was that the piece?
Speaker 1:I think it was mentally too. I think the game of hockey, hockey, so mental and confidence wise where, where I had the confidence of watching these guys put up 60 points and whatever they did 50 points I'm like I can I was pretty calm, I can, I can figure out a way to do that or kind of replicate a season Like they had and be a late, a late pick and and then my first game came after COVID and it was like we got beat and I was like terrible and it was like I was dash four, my line and I were dash four and we're like okay, we got a reset. And then the next weekend I great at I had a slow start, like the start of my second year. I had two assists in eight games and no goals. Wow. So I'm like I was like this sucks, like I was like so frustrated and then I scored my first goal and then the next shift I scored again. So I'm like, oh, now here maybe something's coming.
Speaker 1:And as the year kind of progressed, it just it never slowed down and I kind of fed off of of Sean Farrell and and Matt Cornado they're having years and and kind of replicating what they did and just taking video. I'd sit down and watch video with with Mike Garman, who was our goalie coach at the time, and and review clips of NHL guys and of myself and kind of find ways that I can score goals from different angles and be creative and stuff like that. And I went into the Christmas break I was still under point for game at Christmas and my dad was like you got to, you're fine, like, just have fun. This back after your worst. The worst thing in the world is you have to go back another year to Chicago and in my head.
Speaker 2:I'm like I don't want to do that, I want to. I want to go to college.
Speaker 1:I want to prove I can play, and then I started. I went after our first five games after the break. I think I had three, I had two hat tricks and two two-goal games and then from there it just exploded in the back half of the year and Adam Fantilli got healthy so I was playing with him and Sean Farrell and we lost half a team to injury. So then it was just the three of us playing and they played us a ton and we were still winning. We were having fun.
Speaker 1:And when you're having fun, like you know, in hockey it's like you can't do anything wrong, like you could throw behind the back pass and it's going to work and everything goes your way, kind of thing. And and then it was just trying to prove I could play defensive as well, as was the mindset and and kind of solidifying my game as a whole before college. And surely enough, like I, I went into the draft and there were a couple teams that called me and were like hey, we're going to pick you up in the second round and we're excited. And Arizona was like crickets from them, like they didn't say a word to me. They talked to me the day before the draft and I was like that'd be cool, like to go to Arizona. That's obviously a team I grew up cheering for and I thought I was going to go to Winnipeg or Minnesota or somewhere like that.
Speaker 1:And then, like out of nowhere, I was getting changed. I was at the USA hockey world junior tryout Mackie Samuels, which is like you just got picked and we like started laughing and I was like okay, whatever. And we looked at my phone and it was the Arizona. We were pretty excited and my dad had no idea. So he was like he was almost emotional. I don't see him emotional too often and he was in that room and it kind of took him by surprise, which was cool, yeah because was he?
Speaker 2:was he involved, like officially, with the team at that point or not?
Speaker 1:he was like it is. I don't know what he was at the time. He was like, uh, he was kind of just around the rink to help out in any way they kind of needed. But like when, when you know someone getting drafted or you have a friend or with a family friend or something, they don't put that player on the board at all.
Speaker 1:So you have no idea where they're listed on the board until draft day right then, once draft day came around, he saw where I was and he's like, oh, there's a chance that we could get him with with one of our picks. And then the guys on the board kind of kept going off and he's like, oh, my goodness, like he's going to go with our next pick. And then that's when he kind of figured there's a chance and he's like he was pretty excited.
Speaker 2:So you weren't even at like, you weren't even in front of a television or anything, you were just doing your thing, yeah.
Speaker 1:Cause I was about to get in the shower because we just got off the ice, so I was getting ready to hop to the shower and then we had all our phones out for the draft because it was the USA World Junior Camp.
Speaker 1:So there was a lot of guys there waiting to get picked and we were all laughing right. Of course, as I'm getting in the shower my mom's upstairs she's probably crying and then I finally got to hug her after I got out of the room. And then I finally got to hug her after I got out of the room, but it was pretty cool.
Speaker 2:Oh, that is super cool. Interesting that USA hockey chooses to have it on that day, though that seems a little bit interesting.
Speaker 1:I know it was, it was the COVID. So why was it? It was that later draft Cause they had the draft in like October for the year before and then that draft got pushed back until I think it was like the end of July because the NHL season started late because they were in a bubble.
Speaker 2:So I didn't push back so.
Speaker 1:I don't know why they didn't want to change their date. They kind of because they wanted to do it where everyone was together. So they did like a draft party the night before.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that makes sense. But it was like I wish we could have had the morning off a little bit so we could have been with our families.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, no.
Speaker 1:That happens.
Speaker 2:You mentioned the mindset I mean. So it sounds like it wasn't like too underwhelming or too disappointing to not hear your name called like the first time around. Right, like you, you were in a good headspace with that and and it wasn't like you had to mentally really overcome anything. Is that accurate?
Speaker 1:yeah, it was like it's obviously one of those things where you're seeing your friends and guys you played against your life, get drafted and and you want to get picked but at the end of the day I mean there's no, there's no reason for me to have gotten. I haven't proven anyone really a real reason to pick me and and enough that it was like I was bad but I'm like I wasn't good enough to be an nhl selection and that's that's part of growth is being honest with yourself, like I'm like I can get there, but right now I'm not ready, and that's kind of part of it and, looking back, like what a gift not to be picked really, yeah, right, yeah exactly.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because like nothing wrong with being an eighth rounder or seventh rounder, like awesome, I mean. But if you knew that the next year you were going to be a second rounder, I'd take the second rounder any day, right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly. That's my joke I'm a second rounder but technically I'm a ninth rounder. So's it's one of those things I go through it twice, but it makes it fun well, you mentioned mindset and I don't even know we never really discussed it.
Speaker 2:But, like what I do I mean, the podcast isn't what I do what I do is I'm a mindset coach for players, so that's that's really what I help with. I help with the guys off the ice and I help with the transitions between things like overcoming maybe some disappointment, like you were talking about with with the, with the draft, and confidence, like how do we, how do we create it? How do we develop it? How do we keep it? How, how did you? It was going to be a wrong segue.
Speaker 2:I talk a lot about belief systems too, right, so a belief system is a real integral part of success and and after you've gone through a season where maybe you know, you didn't hear your name called and things didn't go quite as you wanted them to, to maintain that belief that, yes, I do belong, you know, yes, I can do this, yes, this is a path for me. Um, how, where did that exist for you? Like, how and how did that exist or did it exist? Sometimes we just go along and we just play right and happens, happens, but I think for most guys, there's some type of a belief system in place that allows them to think that the journey is going to happen and it's worth it, the work they're putting in.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's a couple people like and my dad was big into that or he kind of helped me keep my confidence. But we brought in Matt Calderoni into into Chicago and he's like a sports psychology and and kind of talk to you through things and you'd have individual sit downs with him and and he kind of explained the process and anytime he'd be like I don't know if he'd correct it and be like no, no, no, he's like you could do that, like why can't you? Like there's a reason you're here to begin with. And then Ryan Hardy, I think he's he works with the many beliefs now and and he's the one who drafted me and brought us all in together and and just talking with him and and the way that he put his belief into me and and and kind of put trust into me to play big minutes and to play with younger guys to help them grow, gave you a little bit of belief that if they trust me to play with the younger guys, then I'm obviously doing something right.
Speaker 1:And he's a guy that when I was at my lowest at times he would call me and be like hey, you're good and you'll figure it out. There's a reason you're here, and I think, just kind of over and hearing that there's a reason that you're playing at this level and that you're going to college and like, you're not a bad hockey player, you're obviously somewhat decent and and if you really care about the game, then then you'll find a way to get kind of through anything. And it was something that I didn't have, as I think, as much belief in myself as other people did, and and knowing that there was belief around me and people believed in me, because I think what kind of boosted that mentality.
Speaker 2:I love that story. Yeah, that's great. I mean, your circle matters, like right, like your, your mentorship circle matters, even like your peer group really matters. And I think that the more we insulate ourselves with good people, with good ideas, with good belief systems, with positive support, like how can that not help? Right, like how can that not help? And being open to that, you know, I always I mean we only have our own window to look through as far as reference points are concerned.
Speaker 2:But I just know for me, like it's not that I didn't have good people around me, but I was a little bit like stoic in the idea of letting people in you know, I felt like it was, it was, it was my journey and, um, and I think if there was one thing that I would try and do differently if I was like 22-year-old Jason Padone again, would be to really like build that circle right, Like to find people that gave a shit about me and that cared about me and that wanted to help and listen right and just be available. It sounds like you have been willing to listen and to build a circle.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I think that's having someone like you said, like people that will listen to you, almost away from the team that you're playing with or the group that you're with, as well as having guys on your team, because it's like my biggest thing and my family's biggest thing is like when you're at the rink. It's like be a fountain, don't be a drain. Like don't stop the energy out of the room, bring as much energy as you can drain. Like don't stop the energy out of the room, bring as much energy as you can.
Speaker 1:Be positive, be, be someone people are happy that you're in the room with and if you have any negative thoughts or things that are bothering you, then then talk to the people that are outside of that room that aren't going to be impacted in a way of like a negative emotion towards the team. Or I got a circle with, obviously, my dad, my uncle and my aunt and my friends from high school that don't play hockey anymore. Like I got a pretty good circle that I can trust and go to whenever I need and, like you said, it's so much more important just to have people that will listen, compared to the people that are always almost telling you what to do at times.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a really, really awesome lesson. I love hearing that you know like to To be what you can be to that group. One of the best things about hockey is that it is a team and those guys around you. You want them to be as good as you can because it helps you be better and all that. That culture piece is a huge thing. But you're also saying in that lesson but hey, we're human, there is shit that goes wrong sometimes, there is bad stuff, we're not feeling amazing all the time. But let's find, let's find a vessel or a person or a mentor, some someone outside of that team culture where we can express that and be human. And you know, and talk through that.
Speaker 2:Uh, because that's an important piece. You know, like, I think, mental, mental fitness, I like to call it, which is, I believe, is like a foundation to mental health. If we have better mental, we'll have better mental health. There's a reality of that. I mean, as a hockey player, you've been conditioned from the time you were probably this big that you needed to be tough, right, like we need to be, tough.
Speaker 2:We need to be strong, we need to be this, we need to be that. It's tough to be I'll use the word vulnerable. It's tough to be vulnerable in that type of team environment. Right like I am, I'm struggling with this or that, so having something outside of that vehicle can be super beneficial. Um, I just wanted to express that because I think sometimes junior guys, young guys like we get caught up in this idea of being something and we don't allow ourselves to feel what we're feeling. Can you relate to that at all?
Speaker 1:yeah, and I think that's part of what hockey is like. Hockey players want to be tough and they they don't. Sometimes it's not cool to be vulnerable, if that's the right word to say that, but I mean in tucson we had, we had talks this year as a group about, about pass and stuff that has happened and what's kind of brought you into this point. And everyone has a story. And that's the thing. Like no matter how cool and tough you want to be, there's something that happened in your life or something that happened around you that's going to be hard to deal with on any given day.
Speaker 1:And as hard as it is to talk about sometimes, sometimes you need to talk about things and get it off your chest because you hold onto it then it makes everything harder, not just the hockey side, but just life away from the game can get hard.
Speaker 1:And and when the dog days of the season kind of get going where it's the middle of the year and maybe you're not doing, other teams not doing well, and then those things start to creep up again. But I think, like you said, like it is, mental fitness is is so important now to the game and and you don't have to be this, and you can be as tough as you want, but at the same time, opening up about your feelings and being vulnerable at times doesn't make you not tough. It honestly is at times makes you tougher to kind of share your emotions and to speak up because there are other guys in the room that want to speak up and say something but don't because they're they're scared to, or something like that yeah which is that's part of the game now yeah, man, I think that I think you said that perfectly and I think that's a really cool insight.
Speaker 2:Like there is a piece, there's a piece of of being a professional athlete and I think hockey is is a very unique piece of being a professional athlete, because mental toughness is a prerequisite, like you know. Like you have to be consistent, you have to be able to physically handle pain, you have to physically handle the fear of somebody legitimately trying to like knock your block off at all times, right. So like there's a there's a courage piece of it. So like mental toughness you can't avoid, you need it, but that doesn't mean that we don't have to. We have to be emotionally stunted, right, and I think, like that's the difference, don't have to. We have to be emotionally stunted, right, and I think, like that's the difference, right, like there is a gladiator aspect, but there is also a human inside that, inside that gladiator that has stuff to deal with, right.
Speaker 2:So, uh, you using that word vulnerable, or we using it together, I guess, like that's tough, that's also tough, right. Like to stand there and say, hey, like I'm worried about this or I'm worried about that, or I had a hard time here, like that is exposure and that allows you now to grow and be tougher. So I it's nice that we can talk about that, because I think when we do, in the competitive nature of hockey players and the way that we're built like if we can reframe that as being, hey, this is actually mental toughness training is being able to talk about this openly, like it's actually actually making you stronger. It might make it a little bit easier for for some guys to go there and help them in that aspect. So you know what I mean. Thanks for thanks for bringing that aspect up. I think that's cool.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2:Just going to take a short break from my conversation with Josh Don't to provide an opportunity for my partner at umh 68 and show sponsor elite prospects to get a word out. And elite prospects is the gateway to hockey online. Since 1999, elite prospectscom is the number one statistical hockey resource, serving over a million unique visitors weekly. It offers the most informative hockey player database on the web and has the most reliable transaction tracker available For youth hockey players. Ep is your very own online showcase to highlight your achievements and help secure future playing opportunities. Coaches, scouts and schools at every level of the game. Consider Elite Prospects their one-stop shop to discover future stars. Hockey fan, crazy about the NHL, the draft and your team's top prospects? There's no better resource than EP Rinkside providing insight and analysis on players worldwide throughout written features, video breakdowns, interviews and more. Head to EliteProspectscom now and experience your gateway to hockey.
Speaker 2:Now let's get back to the interview with Josh Doan, and I think that's a cool segue to what Dave Oliver told me about a little story that he heard with you. You mentioned that you were a late developer and I think there's probably lots of lessons in there, because there's lots of guys right now, especially at the age group I'm watching a lot because my oldest, as you know, is mean and and they're smaller and there's no hair on their legs and they're trying to figure it out. You know what I mean. It's like it's a tough game, you know I mean to to be behind like that. So you as as a, as an, as a late developer uh, you said you were small and and and undersized. Like what were some of the challenges you experienced with that and what were maybe some of the some of the secrets that you had and being able to overcome it?
Speaker 1:yeah, I think the first thing is obviously like when you're undersized, sometimes there's some guys that are obviously a little bit quicker and faster and for some guy, like if you have no muscle, you're not going to be able to to be as quick or fast, to avoid checks and stuff like that, and so I found myself on on the end of getting knocked over a good amount of times. But you almost you learn how to play the game the right way and that's the way that I kind of like you figure out ways to to play at that size that allow you to to get pucks back or to to win battles or to make plays and in tight and stuff like that. And as you grow, your body develops and you're stronger. Now you're playing the right way, but you're also bigger and stronger so you can win pucks in other ways as well and and create offense in other ways.
Speaker 1:But the hardest part for me, honestly, was going from being so small and then almost growing too quick. My u16 year I was, I grew about five inches and 40 pounds over the summer, 30 pounds over the summer, and I used to be able to kind of get away and no one could hit me. And I'm like every time I make a move I'm getting someone's getting a piece of me, because I'm used to this extra weight and height. So there there's. Every part of that journey is hard, but it it mentally sets you up for we'll handle adversity in the future and you and you're physically stronger and more mature because you understand how to play the game hard and now you have size to go with it. So it was one of those things that I say it's the biggest blessing, in disguise, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, I like the way that you say you learn how to play the game the right way.
Speaker 2:I think that's something that I totally see, and and I've seen lots is that smaller players have to. You have to move pucks, you have to yeah, right, you have to move pucks, and then you have to be able to find space. And if you can't do those two things, then you're not going to be relevant. And so how often have you seen and you could probably even look back, you, you know, in in your, in your playing days the, the early developer, the guy that could take pucks around people or through people and didn't have to move pucks? At some point that guy gets caught up because everyone else grows and now they have to relearn the game again, right, like, and those guys sometimes fall away. So, um, you know, maybe you can speak to that Like. I think it's an advantage If you can stick around being an undersized player and if you can keep yourself relevant and then that growth does come, I think you are better off even than the guy who's an early developer.
Speaker 1:Oh for sure I. It's crazy. There are kids that when you're younger it's demoralizing when a guy can go around every single player and go tuck one in short side and you can't even I can't skate down the ice, open the puck or I'm going to get stripped or hit or whatever. So it's like I got to learn to give go and create offense that way. And this kid just picked up a puck from his own end, went coast to coast and scored and and that was again.
Speaker 1:I think that's part of having a good, a good background with having my dad where he was like hey, he's like at some point he's going to have to learn to pass the puck, because when you get to that U16 and junior level, everyone has to pass the puck or you're not going to be able to really do much.
Speaker 1:And then you slowly kind of catch guys like that. And then there are some that learn how to play the right way still and have success. But it's hard both ways to be the biggest guy. When you're younger it's great. When you're older it's hard. You never learn how to play the right way. And then the role kind of reversed a little bit. So I can attest to a lot of guys that I grew up playing against that were way bigger, stronger and faster than me, that throughout the years when, when the game gets a little bit more serious and and you have to play the right way, they get kind of caught up to and and passed by the guys that were five foot one and 100 pounds soaking wet when they're 14.
Speaker 2:So it's funny it gives and takes yeah, and a lot of those guys aren't probably playing anymore. You mean, that's the thing. And I think the other thing too, which maybe we can speak about is like the courage piece. Like some of those bigger guys don't actually have to be as courageous or know how courageous they are, because you know you are constantly in more danger as a younger player. You know what I mean. So you have to face like that thing whatever you want to call it, I mean fear, maybe is the right word oh, yeah, and um, and that was one of the stories.
Speaker 2:Maybe you can speak to that and I don't know if you remember it, but like Dave Oliver told me the story about talking with your dad and said that you were you know he's looking at pictures and you were, like you know, a foot shorter than all your teammates, essentially right, and and I don't know the conversation you had with him, meaning your dad or exactly what it was, but I mean I'll parap and and and you can tell me how close I got.
Speaker 2:But you were like you know, dad, like I'm, like I'm smaller than everybody, like you know I'm, I'm scared out there, like I'm getting knocked over all the time, and and I guess your dad said, hey, like there wasn't one game in 20 years that I played where I wasn't scared on the ice yeah, you know. And and like that's something that we need to figure out, or whatever, like I think that's like such a powerful message coming from a father who played as long as he did, who's standing six, three, 230 pounds, and he's telling you that he's scared. You must have been like holy, you know. Like I think that's an interesting message, can you is that? One, is that an accurate story? And two, like, if you do remember it, like what did that mean to you?
Speaker 1:yeah, I was. I remember that like it yesterday. That was my first ever USA or USA, my first ever Blazer camp when I was 14. And like I lined up to start the game versus Jermaine Lohan at the time, who was their best player and I think he was 6'4", like 220 pounds, and I'm like, all right, well, I have no chance. Which is him Like, if he gets the puck, I'm not getting it back. I'm not getting it back. And if he's chasing me, he's taking it every time.
Speaker 1:And I remember, throughout that game I'm like, oh my goodness, like this is. Like I'm helpless out here, like I have no chance, I'm too small, like this is like I was small for my own age. Now there's 20 year olds out here that are like I'm really small now, like this is. And I remember, after the game I was, I was pretty got pretty emotional because I was tearing up and I'm like I, I was almost like dad, this isn't fun. Like I'm. I'm scared, I'm getting abused out there. Like this isn't, like. This might not be kind of like for me this game. I was like this is. It's not fun Like, and it isn't fun at times when you're that little and you're just getting bullied, like there's. You almost feel like you're actually helpless out there. You're scared of everything and anyone can hit you. So it's one of those things where you're uncomfortable, and that's what he said. He's like well, you enjoy the game and you have fun. And he's like but I don't want you to think I play as big as I am, Like I'm scared. He's like I don't go out there and think I'm untouchable and I kind of laughed at him. I'm like yeah right, like what are you scared of? Like who's going to hit you? Like you're 235 pounds, like he was literally over 100 pounds heavier than me at the time. So I'm like there's no one who can hit you. Like I might be bigger or whatever, but anybody can hit anybody the level that he played at. He's like everyone's strong and he's like I'm scared every game.
Speaker 1:We're both pretty religious, so he talked about he's like I can pray for safety and before every game I ask for safety, but he's like there's not enough fear. That goes in playing hockey and I don't care who you are. You can lie to yourself and say you're not scared. You're scared of something happening, and that was, to me, kind of the thing that set me on the edge. It was like, wow, like if he's scared, and then he's like, he's naming guys that he's played with that are like idols of mine, guys that he's played with that are like idols of mine. Where he's like, I guarantee you he's scared. I've talked to him. He's uncomfortable getting on the ice at times and and that was kind of what mellowed me down a little bit from that fear of playing hockey every day and kind of like, oh, if he's scared, then I'm fine. Like guys scores 35 goals in the nhl. Like what am I like?
Speaker 1:yeah and and then and then I. It just gave me that hope to continue to play hockey and have fun, and that's kind of what led me to continue to play and enjoy myself and gave me that joy of the game back, like anytime I'm on the ice. The happiest I'll be in life is when I'm on the ice, no matter what I'm doing. So that's part of what's shaped me and it's a true story. There's more to it, obviously. I was like emotionally was like emotionally, like I'm like distraught. I'm like dad this sucks, like I hate hockey and you know you don't. He's like you're just upset right now and and you'll get over it. But but if I didn't have stuff like that or something to back me in my corner and be like, hey, it's, people are scared, that's the game, it's a physical game. There's no one who's not scared on the ice.
Speaker 2:That's such a perspective shift, right Like for you as a young man, to hear that and and it almost makes you feel like I think sometimes we can feel so isolated and we can also feel like what might be internally construed as like a handicap or a problem.
Speaker 2:Right Like we're not, and and for you that might have been like I'm not good enough, or I'm not big enough, or I'm not going to be strong enough or I'm not courageous enough. Right like it's nice to hear that yeah, there are other guys, probably everybody that enters a game with some level of fear, right and and so now they've been able to somehow manage it and now it gives you kind of hope that you can empower yourself to manage that as well. This isn't something that can't be overcome. It's something that your father was able to overcome for 20 years, that he was able to fight through and and and to be courageous. And I just think I love, I love that message of that story and it's actually one of the things that I talk with my clients about when we talk about confidence and you know, know, because we want it, we want confidence right, but like I, mean, can you josh doan even before your first nhl game?
Speaker 2:or maybe we go back to that whl camp? Did you really have the right to be confident out there? Probably not, right. Like you said, you're 100 pounds lighter than everybody else. You're maybe slower than everybody else. Like you'd be delusional if you would be like yeah, yeah like I'm confident out here, let's rock and roll, right, yeah.
Speaker 2:But I do say that there's another way that we can handle that, and that's with courage. Right, because you might not have confidence, which is a feeling, but you can act courageously, right, you can be brave, um. And I think, when we understand that that's a choice, that's a pretty powerful spot to put yourself in, because now, now, you choose to be courageous and then maybe at some point, confidence does show up, but you can be courageous in the meantime, right yeah, oh for sure, I think it's.
Speaker 1:It's all courage, like anyone who gets on the ice. Now you got to be have a little bit of courage and, like you said, the guys have confidence 24 7 and I think I'm like I want to understand how they have that conference all the time. But then at the same time I'm like you're just crazy, like there's something in your head that you might be a little crazy.
Speaker 2:This cough all the time, but that's part, part of the game yeah, and you know what, who knows, are you on that too, until we walk a mile in their shoes, like they. They could definitely have that swagger and come that way, but you don't know what happens when they get home, or what they're thinking about or anything else. Right, like, um, there's always something. We're all human at the end of the day, and I think, yeah, if we grow the, if we grow the strongest human, uh, behind the hockey mask, then usually a pretty good hockey player shows up.
Speaker 2:So, uh, I really, I really value what you were able to share with us today and and, uh, you know the honesty that you've been given, because I think that there's a lot of ways to get to where you, where you are right now. I mean, your path is is the unique one, and, um, and there's a lot of lessons from everybody's journey. So, thank you for sharing that with us today, and I, uh, I mean, obviously wish you nothing but the best, and maybe we'll, if we're going to have one more thing, if there's one lesson that you do have for somebody who wants to put on that NHL jersey and to score a goal there in that league one day, what would be the message to some younger players or some parents out there right now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's going to sound as easy as you can, but it's the element of just having fun, and when you have fun, be creative. The more creative you are then, the more you're doing, the more you're putting out there. Parents is almost like your kids are creative because they're going to do it with Jason. That was the reason I can do whatever I want on the ice as well. You can do it when you're doing that and be creative on that side of of the game. It is, at the end of the day, you're gonna have fun, so enjoy it yeah, I appreciate that.
Speaker 2:I mean I I you're breaking up a bit for me there, unfortunately, but I definitely understood the message. Like, yeah, be, have fun. When you're having fun, you're enjoying the game you're allowed to, you're letting your creative element shine, which makes you be a unique player in your own right and add your own flavor to the game. I do think that's a very wise piece of advice.
Speaker 2:I see so many players, even at the youth level, that here I am a high-performance coach wanting people to find their best. But that doesn't have to be super serious in nature, right, like we can have fun exploring how to be our best and we can have fun on the during the game and during practice. It doesn't have to be something that we're stoic and serious about. So I, I oftentimes want to connect players to that idea of like, hey, man, you're playing a game, like at the end of the day, you're playing a game and uh, and you got to have fun doing it, and that's probably when your best self is going to show. So, uh, great lesson. Um, best of luck this year. Josh, I really appreciate you spending an hour of your time with us here today. And uh, and yeah, it's going to be fun to see the utah hockey club do its thing this year yeah, I'm excited for the year and thanks for no-transcript.